No, it's Anthony. Webinar vet, welcoming you to another episode of that chat. As you know, we really like to talk about many issues, but particularly we're very fond of talking about sustainability, so I'm really, really thrilled today to have Karen Chenoy from Hill's Pet Nutrition and Dan Tracey from Colgate Palmolive, who is the Chief Sustainability Officer of Colgate Palmolive.

Karen is the Chief Medical Officer of Hills in the European area. So thank you so much for coming on. I've been a big fan of Hills for a long time, but I was asked by the UK team to go down and, and talk to them about how we should be talking about sustainability in practise, and then I went down and saw some of the really cool things that Hills have been doing for a long time, er, and so I was super impressed with your commitment to sustainability and obviously.

Hills are part of the Colgate Palmolive Group, so it's really really great and to have you on board looking at that bigger perspective of not just pet industry but er, you know, consumer goods and and and further afield as well, so, Karen, perhaps you can just fill in the gaps there and and introduce yourself to the, to the audience. Yeah. Thank you so much for having us on today.

This is gonna be a lot of fun and we really appreciate the opportunity. As you said, I'm Doctor Karen Chenoy. I am VP and Chief Veterinarian, is my fancy title, for HILS AMA, so Europe, Middle East, and Africa.

I have been in this role for 1 year. I've been with Hill's Broader Colgate Company for 18 years. All of my time is within the Hills organisation.

I started obviously back in the US. I've got an American accent, English accent in field-based roles. So I started my career really.

In the trenches, in veterinary clinics, spending time with practitioners, understanding their challenges. I have worked with students, worked in a variety of roles in our global headquarters in Kansas, and then my journey brought me here to Europe about a year ago. Prior to my time at Hills, I have spent time in clinical practise, both in small animal medicine and actually, had a role full-time in wildlife medicine for a number of years and have done some teaching.

So a lot of different elements of the veterinary industry and still very much loving what I do. Ah thank you so much Karen, and over to you, Anne. Yeah, and I'm also very thrilled to be here, very happy to be part of this ecosystem, talking to vets and people who love pets.

I have 2 dogs and 2 cats, so I'm a pet lover, and, Hills is near and dear to my heart. So my story is I've been, in fact, we have a celebration today, 35 years with Colgate. Most of my career.

It's, it's getting to the point where it's embarrassing to say how long I've been here, but anyway, most of my career actually was in the supply chain and then more recently over the past 78 years, you know, kind of now leading the enterprise-wide global sustainability. Programme for Colgate. So that includes all our categories, as well, you know, hills, of course.

But, one thing to mention across my supply chain years, I worked in many different roles across the end-end supply chain. I like Karen's comment about in the trenches, you know, I cut my teeth as a shift team leader in a Hill's plant in Bowling Green, Kentucky. And then, so I was in manufacturing for many years and then Customer service and logistics, running regions of plants and divisions.

And at one point, I was leading manufacturing for all of Hill's. So I had two stints at Hills, the second stint based in Topeka. So, I have obviously lots of love for Hills for many reasons, and I'm thrilled to be here to talk about what we're doing today and in the future.

Yeah, and then it's really great to have you on, really thrilled to, to get you on for, for your experience, and of course I suspect most of us listening are Colgate fans with the, with the toothpaste and was reading recently, well over 90% of the, the tubing is now recyclable, reusable or compostable, so this is one of my pet, subjects, the whole idea of circular economy, it's. So important that we can reuse and er not just throw things away, isn't it? Yeah, no, circularity is, you know, I guess the holy grail in some respects, and we talk about circularity, but it's all about the circular economy.

So in order to achieve that, we have to make the economics work, and certainly at Colgate, and we'll get into it more around what we're doing at Hills, but we're part of the Ellen MacArthur Global commitment, Ellen MacArthur Foundation global commitment, which is specific around plastic, which is one of, you know, when some, when we say circularity, it can mean many things, of course, not just packaging, but it can mean water and energy and so forth. But. You know, we'll, I, I often talk about it in the context of plastic packaging.

We consider that sort of an existential issue for Colgate, Palmolive as a company because all of our products come in plastic packaging in some form or fashion. So, it's something. That, we take very seriously because plastic sits on the earth for 500 years or so.

So it's, you know, and it keeps growing. So we really are committed to reducing the amount of virgin plastic we use and making everything recyclable. And to do that, you know, a big chunk of our business, significant part of our business is our oral health business.

We are the #1 producer of toothpaste in the world. We sell roughly 50% of the world's toothpaste. So we knew we had to make the tube recyclable as a starting point.

So that's what we've done and you just cited the figures. We committed once we perfected the design and the engineering to roll it out across the world to all our brands. Every tube of toothpaste that we make, we started in the US and Europe, and those figures you, just quoted are true in the US.

I think it's now 95% of all toothpaste tubes and 75% of all tubes, because if you think about it, condiments, shampoo, and things are also coming in tubes have converted to a recyclable. Design and, and Europe as well, Europe that we've rolled out there as well. So, and we're, you know, completing that around the world and now, and we'll talk about it maybe in a, in a little bit, you know, we're, we're transferring that knowledge to the hills pet nutrition bags, which are also plastic.

Thanks, and, and of course circular economy we'll talk about a bit later, also involves natural systems as well, cos sometimes we can just think it's plastic, but . I know we're gonna be talking a bit about regenerative agriculture later, so we will come to that, but first question is, I'm gonna go to Karen, you know, obviously a lot of vets listening in, give us a bit of an overview of what Hill's Pet Nutrition are doing around sustainability, maybe two or three, you know, high points, highlights that fits into its mission today, and then how you feel about that because it's really interesting with the survey we did with kinetic. It was so important for people working in a company that they can see their company interested in that and some some companies more interested than others.

How, how does that fit in with your own personal values and and and mission as well when you see what Hills and Colgates are doing? Sure, there's quite a lot that I could say here. I'll try not to get too long winded, but I think first and foremost, I'll start by saying that I think we're in a really unique place at Hills, at Colgate Palmolive, to be having this dialogue and, and, you know, my perspective as a veterinarian working for Colgate is that we both are a consumer products good company that has the resources that come with being a multinational, company focused in that space.

And then I also very much view us and, and see us probably first as a member of the animal health industry in terms of our position at Hills. And I'm not sure that a lot of veterinary professionals really understand that Colgate Palmolive more broadly is very focused on professionals. So, of course, we at Hills are very focused on supporting veterinary professionals.

We also in our oral health business are very focused on dental professionals. And then we also have a skincare business that's focused on working with dermatologists and aestheticians. And so, Again, I think we're very uniquely positioned to be thinking in a big way about sustainability and having these broader conversations and bringing a lot of information and innovation to industries.

But then also seeing things from the lens of the practitioner and, and I know in the discussion, we're gonna talk about the Veterinary Green Discussion Forum as a space where I think you're looking to bring Bring some sustainability conversations closer into the profession. So it's, it's really an interesting area to kind of think about the intersections of these different components coming together and how again at Colgate Hills, I think we're quite uniquely positioned to be having conversations like the one we'll have today in kind of more closely to the Hills side of things, as I know you know, we were founded by a veterinarian, Doctor Mark Morris, 75 years ago. He really believed in the role that nutrition plays in pet health.

And from the very beginning, it's been in our DNA to support veterinary professionals, to be innovative, to be finding new ways to help people and their pets. And of course, that's an area I'm extremely passionate about. It's why I've been a part of the company for 18 years.

And I really see that as a veterinarian, I've been able to move from helping one on one interactions with, with students and with clients to now being in a position where I can have a bigger impact on the lives of people and their pets and veterinary practitioners through some of these broader areas of, of work that we do in supporting the profession and supporting our communities. And just to touch on a couple of points, many know that we have a long-standing commitment to supporting shelter professionals. So we have a Hills Food Shelter and Love programme and also an annual Mission Forever Friends event that we put on here in Europe.

And through those initiatives, we've helped 16 million pets and counting since 2002. Find their loving homes and get adopted from shelters. Part of that is donating more than €277 million in pet food since 2002 and making sure that those pets have, quality nutrition that helps them be more adoptable.

And so again, it's some of those efforts that go kind of above and beyond our day to day sales of our products that make me feel very committed to the organisation and, and proud of our values and what we stand for. Yeah, I think, you know, you see with actions like that a real net positive business. I just wanted to, to put an umbrella on top of everything that Karen said, which was, again, near and dear to my years spent in the hills business, but we have a purpose statement at the company and it's reimagining a healthier future for all people, their pets and our planet.

And I think that's kind of a nice umbrella on what, like, as I said, on, on what Karen said, because we really do think of ourselves as a, a health first company and that applies very broadly to the consumers that use all of our products including the pets and, and ultimately if we have a healthy business, we can have a, a bigger impact at scale on the planet and that's our kind of how we think about getting there. I really enjoyed when I came down to hills a few years ago now to talk about sustainability, how, you know, as a vet we should think about it, and then saw all the things that you were doing, so and this figure might be slightly wrong, you can hopefully correct me, but I think it was in the previous decade, hills had reduced their carbon input by about 14%, waste as well from water, so you were getting much better at recycling. Solar panels on factories, and these were things that were happening really when nobody was paying much attention to carbon, I'm not a huge carbon and nothing else fan, but you know certainly we need to be looking at that and it was really heartening to see that you've done that work without anybody really pushing you for it, but just because you knew it was the right thing to do.

Yeah, we've been actually Colgate Palmov as an enterprise has been, we've been measuring our across all our operations globally and we are very global. We have over 50 sites globally including Hills, and we've been measuring our reduction to greenhouse gas emissions or carbon, as you mentioned, waste to landfill, water, energy, and electricity since 2002. So for over two decades we've been measuring that impact.

Very carefully every year and we've set targets for ourselves. We were actually the first overall consumer goods company, multinational consumer goods company, I should say, to have our net zero carbon targets by 2040 approved by SBTI. I'm not sure if your audience knows SBT.

PI, but they're kind of the global authority on setting carbon reduction targets. Scope 12, and 3. Now we're going to get geeky, but anyway, that's, that's really how, what, what you were just talking about, that's kind of the, framework around which we're structuring our, our, our reduction programme.

I suspect that we will have a few geeky people who know that it's the science-based targets initiative just in case we, we, and that's the other thing, Karen. Karen mentioned we're in addition to being health oriented, we're a science-based, so science did that science first so we consider ourselves science experts and that's really important when we engage the professionals as Karen mentioned. I'm always careful when I go to restaurants now as to what I eat, so I, I tend to be vegetarian or pescatarian outside, and I'm careful with my meat when I'm when I'm at a restaurant and I'll ask about provenance and you get a sort of, you know, a blank look from people, so I was really impressed to hear about some of the great work Hills are doing.

I think he won an award, the Good Egg Award, it's always good, it's a very British phrase that you're, he's a good egg, we say, so for you to get a good egg Award, you may not appreciate it as Americans, but it's a really good thing to get from the, Compassionate World Farming. And then I know that you've also been doing a lot of work around sourcing of ingredients, leading you to being accepted into the European chicken commitment, so perhaps tell us why did these 2 august bodies decide that you, Deserve those awards. Yeah, I'm happy to share.

I'm also laughing because I remember back to when I was on boarding at Hill's, a veterinarian that was meeting with me to go through my training said, Karen, you're a good egg. So as an American, too funny. So the two awards, the good The Egg Award is by the Compassion in World Farming organisation, and that award recognises our achievement of using 100% cage-free eggs and egg ingredients in our European products, and that's a target that we hit a full year ahead of schedule in 2024.

And then related to that, we actually collaborated with the Compassion in World Farming Group. So that's the organisation that gives out that Good Egg Award. And as part of our collaboration, we built out a very realistic and audited roadmap that helps ensure that we can deliver on those commitments.

So it's not just, you know, making some statements and getting an award, but really walking the talk and making sure that we are following through in, in the roadmap and the commitments there. And then the second one, as you mentioned, is that we signed on to the European chicken commitment. And again, we were the first pet food manufacturer in Europe to do so.

That means that we have a target that 100% of our chicken in our European-made products will meet higher welfare standards by 2030. We're very proud of that commitment that the company has made as well. I think it's so important, you know, as, as veterinary animal health companies that one, animal health is something that we care about, but also the welfare of those animals, you know, that we're stewards over them, aren't we, and so I'm, I'm really pleased that you've made those commitments and and won those awards.

How do we then perhaps move on just to talk a little bit about, I want to talk about the true zero waste initiative which I, I saw a bit of evidence of when I was down in. In Surrey and then er leftovers, can you talk to us a little bit about those, I don't know whether er Karen or Anne, you want to go first on that. Yeah, why, why don't I start with the concept of true, and then, and then we can talk about circularity in its broader sense.

But so true with capital T R U E is something we embraced at Colgate. It's been now over 5 years. It stands for Total Resource Use and Efficiency, the acronym TRU.

And this was a programme that was started by something called the GBCI which is loosely affiliated with the US GBC, which people out there, many people are familiar with the LEED programme, LEED, which is the kind of global certification of the built environment or, or you know, Buildings that are more efficient and have, you know, lots of efficiency, smart buildings, things built in can be awarded the lead certification. So true then followed to try to recognise and certify operations buildings. It could be warehouses, it could be our, our offices, but our, our factories, our manufacturing sites really embrace this, certification process.

In fact, we had been. Doing work around reducing the amount of waste we send to landfill for, for a number of years and then we decided that we were ready for a more external recognition. Related to that and that's where we teamed up with GBCI to bring on the true certification or true zero waste certification programme.

So basically what that is, is a certification programme where a site has to meet a long list of criteria over 30 different checkpoints. The elevator pitch that I give that, that's probably the most difficult one to meet is that. The site has to demonstrate that it is sending less than 10% of all the waste out of the site to landfill for a full year and then maintain that.

And that includes everything down to if the site has a cafeteria where the Employees eat, even that waste can't go to landfill. So they have to come up with, you know, solutions for that waste. And so our sites really embrace that and they did things called dumpster dives where they, Examined all their waste and they decided, you know, out of all that waste, what could they reduce, reuse, recycle before they sent anything to landfill.

And in fact, the very first site to become true zero waste certified was a hills site. In, in the US in Ohio, and they went from sending, and don't quote me on this, but something, it, it, it was dramatic. They went from sending like 4 or 5 dumpsters to the landfill per week to like 4 per month.

So they really reduced the amount of waste. So, Colgate Palmolive, is the number one company with true zero waste certified sites around the world, and we're, we have certification sites in on 6 continents and I think. I think over 40 countries around the world, so, which if you think about it, is pretty impressive for places which don't quite have the infrastructure that we do in Europe or the US, so.

And I think it shows true commitment when somebody goes through their dumpster. That's, that's commitment then, isn't it, when you, when you're growing through your weight. And trying to sort it out, so er whoever's done that, they need a pat pat on the backhand.

Yeah, no, it's kind of, we have great store. I mean, our operations have become extremely innovative. Like we have a site in South Africa that produces soap and there's a lot of soda ash that comes out as a result that, that they have to get rid of.

So they partnered with a brick and cement layer down the street and they send the soda ash down the street and they use that to make bricks. Which by the way, the plant then brought back and used to build additional kind of infrastructure on site. So that's, that's the ultimate circular story circularity in action, yeah.

In line with that comment, I was just gonna add to for Hills, it's not only manufacturing sites, but one of the sites we're most proud of is the Hills Global Pet Nutrition centre in Kansas, which is where our research and development facilities are and where we have hundreds of pet partners, cats and dogs that live in those facilities. And so you imagine caring for them in a way that's, you know, providing good standard of care, strong, with a strong animal welfare policy, and doing so in a way that's, true zero waste certified. It's quite impressive.

And, and then just the left, is that really filling in all the kind of idea of leftovers logic. I love the fact, I, I just thought true was true, so total resource use efficiency is a really nice acronym. I'm, I'm building up acronyms here.

I'm, I'm pleased with this we have lots of sustainability. You know, the leftovers, and maybe Karen can talk to this more, the leftovers logic is really more a Hill's terminology because it's food, pet food, and I love it. I think it's great.

So it's really trying to make use of all parts of the ingredient infrastructure ecosystem, I guess. But I think it's, it's nice. I don't know if you have any other.

I think I would say that pet food manufacturing is almost inherently circular to that regard. Ingredients that we would accept readily into the pet food supply that may be things that are not as readily accepted by people. And of course, at Hill's, we were talking about being a science-based company.

That's very true at Hill's as we think about our pet food that we manufacture and provide to improve pets' health. We, of course, put quality and the nutrient content and things. In our food first and foremost, but to get there through sustainable sources is especially rewarding.

And so specifically, there are organ meats that are highly nutritious, very nutrient dense, that, you know, you or I might not accept as something that we're super excited to eat every day, but that can end up in the pet food supply and be actually very nutritious ingredients that are very readily accepted by cats and dogs. I struggled, my mum would feed me certain bits like kidneys and heart, which I was never that keen on. I, I just refused on liver and off the long room and things so yeah, I, I know where you're coming from there Karen.

But it's great that it's getting used, it's again another really great example of circularity. I suppose at this point I also wanted to thank you, you've been a huge supporter of the Veterinary Green discussion forum, very early days, 2022, I suppose pandemic really, and we've been running webinar vets since 2010. Realised very quickly that we've taken a lot of people off the streets, they weren't driving up to hotels to do their CPD but they were doing it with us, so we knew that we were saving a lot of road and travel miles, and I guess I sat on my haunches of it and patted myself on the back and thought, oh, aren't I doing a good job and then I think the pandemic hit, I mean I've always been passionate about the environment and conservation, but I felt we needed to do more, so we did the sustainability summit which was, An effort to tell positive hopeful stories to vets and nurses so that they felt it was still time to get on the bus and make a difference, but also give them the information to know where they could make that difference cos I think, Vets and nurses don't necessarily know how to start the journey, so there needs to be an education piece.

But then the Green discussion forum was very much about bringing all elements of the industry together to say how can we move faster, lean on, you know, the, the shoulders of giants like yourselves who are doing such great work, because what's the point of me having to do all what you're doing as a small company, I should just basically, you know, R&D rip off and duplicate. So it's been really great to have you on board since the beginning. I suppose how do you feel about that and how do you see that developing, you know, particularly with 2030 in mind, you know, there's a lot of key initiatives that are sort of finishing off there.

And I suppose also how have you been working together maybe on other sustainability initiatives, cos if we work, obviously you're doing a massive amount as Colgate and Hills. But we almost, this is so big a problem, we need to go across the whole industry, don't we? It's two remarks I will make, I think as I learn more and more about the setup of the forum, I'm really impressed by the very innovative approach.

It's not a meeting where you sit in the same spot. All day and hear different lecturers come and share their perspectives, but rather, you're facilitating a real discussion, bringing individuals from different parts of the industry with different perspectives together to have conversations and brainstorm and really bring innovative ideas to life, hopefully. The other thing I will say is that, of course, you know, we're talking today about the work that we do at Hills and as a broader company within Colgate Palmolive, and we're very proud of that, but we certainly don't have all the answers and we cannot change the world by ourselves.

We need to come together and have these conversations and, and work collaboratively. And so a forum like that that brings different groups together is just amazing and you should be very proud of the work you've done over the years since 2022. We're happy to support again this year.

And you know from my side I see it as OK we kind of started it but we don't want to have ownership because actually this is owned by the whole profession, those who want to get involved in it, because if, if you're trying to take ownership of it, then again it it produces it, this is very much a collaborative, a collaborative thing, but I am, you know, really thrilled that you've been involved very, very much from the start and kind of got it very early and . Have been, you know, really supportive of it, so just want to take that opportunity to, to thank you for that and I suppose though, you know as you say, none of us have got all the right answers, but even encouraged to go even faster so any big hairy audacious goals that you've got any, I think big and bold initiatives that you want to perhaps tell us about. So, I think, you know, just building on what you were just saying, partnerships are so key in this space for everything we're working on, from circularity to climate issues to ingredients and, and the sourcing of those ingredients.

So you, we can't escape that. In fact, that's one of the things I love about the work I'm doing right now. It's, it's just incredibly external.

And we're involved in so many different partnerships, not to mention coming together for the veterinary green discussion forum, but we do the same thing with the dental association, with FDI, with the dental profession. We do it with working together across the industry to solve big issues related to plastic packaging to, and, and it's unique. So let's, let's talk about packaging for a minute as an example.

Example and, and to answer your question around our audacious goals, bold goals. You know, we are just, in fact, this week, tomorrow, is Earth Day, and we're gonna be sharing externally at Colgate our enterprise-wide 2030 strategy. So we're gonna be sharing our kind of updated strategy from 2025, which we're sunsetting now.

What I will say is, it's not a revolution, it's an evolution of continuing the work we're doing because there's more work to be done. In some cases, we met targets and, and in those cases we've raised the bar. In other cases, we maybe didn't quite reach them and we will continue that work.

And so there's no, there's nothing. I would say really bold and new. I think some of the targets we've been aspiring to have been bold and difficult.

If you look at Companies like us over the past Let's say decade, the 1st 5 years were about setting targets and goals that we weren't honestly sure how we were gonna meet. In the last 5 years, companies have been more focused on action. What is, what is really feasible, what is practical to actually achieve those targets and goals?

And I think as we've done that, you may read in the media and hear, I mean, we all know the media tells a story the way they want to tell it, that, that companies are walking back or this or that. I would say companies are level setting. They're right sizing their targets to what is feasible and achievable and pragmatic for the business, because after, after all, we are a business, so we have to, we have to find a way to do this that makes sense for the business and that's good for the business and good for the consumer and ultimately good for the planet.

We call that the win, win, win principle. So, all that to say, we have our climate targets as if you recall, I said they're SBTI approved. Our aim is to be net zero carbon by 2040.

That's a big target for us. Packaging, we're continuing to work towards making 100% of our packaging, reusable, compostable, or recyclable. That includes the Hill's packaging.

Hills comes in flexible packaging, which is a big challenge across the industry. Mechanical recycling facilities or they're actually called material recovery facilities or MERFs, which are mechanical in nature, are not set up well to handle flexible materials. So we're working across that ecosystem again, it's an ecosystem, so it's not just about.

You know, companies coming up with a design that's 100% monomaterial plastic ready to be recycled. We're done. We did our job.

If the if the if the reprocessors can't handle it, then we're not done yet. So that's kind of where you have to work across the system. One of the important partnerships we have, which is Hills is leading, is called the recycling Partnership, and they have a flexible work group.

And so Hill's is kind of very active in that. So again, back to the partnerships to solve these big problems. So what is, you know, if getting our packaging, so we're continuing to meet that net zero carbon goal, getting our packaging recyclable, continuing to find pets, those forever homes, and helping support when there's natural disasters is another very important initiative for hills.

So I think. Also, you know I know that you're doing a lot on regenerative agriculture, we're gonna be talking about that and antibiotic stewardship at the Greens discussion forum, but that's also a a a massive focus isn't it, to, to start producing food in a way that you know protects the soil, the soil is our, you know, is what everything's based on and. You know, we need to regenerate the soil, don't we?

Yeah, particularly Hills, which uses quite a lot of agricultural-based products, or materials in the food. That's another big area where we're, I guess you could say, still building our strategy around regen ag. Many of the food and bev companies, you've heard them talking about that already for quite some time, you know, we're quickly using up.

A lot of our agricultural real estate around the world and if we're not doing it in a smart way to protect the future use of that land so we get the best yields we can get and, you know, we're not destroying the future of successful agriculture, you know, we'll, we'll price ourselves out of the market. I like to call on. For example, Pepsi, who talks a lot about potato farming, if they're not protective of, of the soil that they, farm those potatoes on, eventually those potatoes will be too expensive and nobody's going to pay $10 for a bag of Lays.

So it's the same thing translates across to our food, and all agricultural products, so. It's a very important initiative and we're doing some work, particularly around rice. Rice is a key ingredient in, in our food.

We're partnering with the supplier there and it's, it's a really another example of win, win, win. You, you know, the supplier can, if we partner with them to encourage them to do more regenerative practises, they get a better yield, you know, we secure the future of that resource at a reasonable cost. And, you know, everybody wins and the, the planet is ultimately in a better place.

That's where I think big companies like Colgate. It, it sometimes you hear of companies that sort of squeeze their small suppliers, but it actually makes no sense because you need them in partnership with you, don't you, for the long term. Yeah, I know, supplier, partnering with suppliers is, you know, we always want the best quality for the lowest cost, but we also need the resilience for the long term and that's where the partnership is important.

Karen, any, any last thoughts, anything you want to add to those last couple of comments from Anne? Yeah, I think building on that theme of partners and talking about ingredients, we're excited about the sustainability practises through the regenerative agriculture initiatives. And then another kind of layer to that story is looking at fermented protein.

So we're using precision fermentation. We've got a partnership with Bond, a company called Bond to look at different ways we can bring innovative. Solutions, these fermented proteins market, in practise already we have black soldier fly larvae as an insect-based protein that's in, in some of our products that are doing very well.

So as I mentioned earlier, as a science-based organisation, we focus first and foremost on the nutrient levels and providing optimal nutrition to pets, but we can do that through a variety of different innovative approaches using different ingredients. So it's exciting to see where that's gonna take us into the future. Lot, lots of innovation going on and I think the innovation is really important because these are big problems and we're not going to solve them with the same thinking we have to, to think differently using AI using all the strategies and the tools that we've got but it's been a a a real honour to have both of you on telling us what you're getting up to in hills but also in in the bigger picture of er Colgate as well.

So I really appreciate your time. I know how you are both very busy. So I feel feel very special that you've agreed to spend some time with us talking about these really big issues, so thank you once again for for coming on, thanks for all the work that you're doing for the people, planet and the environment and and and the pets as well.

Er and you know thanks for thanks for coming on and thanks everyone for listening and hopefully we will see you on a podcast or a webinar very soon.