Hi everybody and welcome to another episode of Vet Chat. Today I am delighted to be joined by someone who's been a, a loose friend over a decade now, which is a little bit scary. And in recent years has become more and more of a friend and so much so that we've spent several drunken evenings at the London Vet Show trying to find our way out of a Chinese restaurant, .

So Tony Nobles joined me for a conversation and obviously many of you will know Tony is the, the sort of the face of access to industry almost through through Noble Futures. So Tony, is boss to chat. I realise that, you know, for you and I to hold a conversation in anything short of 3 or 4 hours is gonna be a challenge for both of us, but.

I just wondered if you could just start by introducing yourself a little bit to those who, who maybe don't know who you are and sort of what you do and how you've got to this point in life. Sure, what an introduction, Ben. Thanks very much for that.

I mean, I'll try and give a bit more of an introduction rather than trying to find our way out of a Chinese restaurant after a few too many wines after congress. But, thank you very much for the time. It's great to be here.

I'm. Noble, I'm managing director and founder of Noble Futures. We are a recruitment company specifically for animal-related industries, and we recruit only for the supply industry, to that sector.

So we don't recruit for practise staff. We recruit for the entire supply industry, be that pharmaceutical, nutrition, nutraceutical, equipment, services, and everything else that goes around it. My own background, I was I, I studied equestrian and business studies.

And, you know, there's probably many more questions from that, but I, I'm now working in recruitment and love it and have got a fantastic team. So really happy to be here and have a chat with you, Ben. So obviously, you know, you've, you've come from that sort of almost agricultural background and you've you've made that decision to, to go into recruitment, but you know, what, why recruitment?

Interesting. Well, I suppose go back a step when I was studying in equestrian and business studies, typically at that age, I just wanted to be with horses all the time. I don't come from a horse.

Family. And luckily, my dad, who is successful in business himself, pushed me to go down the academic route at that at that time rather than get stuck into a stable yard and earn my earn my way that way. And I'm really happy today that he did that because, through that I was able to study.

My love of horses, but at the same time, we ran alongside another course on business studies as well. So that was valuable. I then went on, I completed my BHSAI and and instructor certificate.

And, you know, I suppose I, once I was at the college, I realised I was probably not alympic quality rider. but, I had an amazing passion for that. And, and through Teaching and training, I really became really interested in, in people and the horses, obviously, as well, and their behaviours, and really working with riders and and their own horses primarily on getting the most out of that relationship and that partnership.

And that really is where I think it stemmed from. Now, I didn't immediately go from the stable yard into into recruitment, like as a natural progression. I realised I wanted to gain more skills in a commercial environment and in a business environment, realising that horses was not going to be entirely my life.

And through that, yeah, I answered an advert for salespeople and, and quickly transpired in the interview that the recruitment agency were actually interviewing me for a job, in their own business rather than for one of their clients. So that's how it ended up, . And, and that was in the 90s.

So yes. So you certainly got the, the youthful good looks, because that was back in the 90s. You don't think you've much of a day.

I, I don't know after three weeks of COVID-19, but yes, yeah. Yeah, I think we've all perhaps taken a little bit more liberal approach to our dress sense for the workplace, it's got to the end of several days where I've been sat there still in my pyjama bottoms going right, OK, we must put some normal clothes on at this point. Well, it's the old news reader readers type, isn't it for the video calls as well, shirt on the top, yeah, yeah, and PJs on the bottom.

But obviously, like, you know, we always look to people that are sort of trendsetters in business and people who, you know, sort of maybe look where there's opportunity, where there's something that's not been exploited previously, potentially. Now, of course, Noble Futures was very much the first into its particular area. Of expertise and and service delivery.

Now over the years, of course, others note your success, and see what you're doing and see that you're doing really well and they try and sort of jump on the bandwagon and, and share a different slice of the pie, but you guys have always maintained that sort of, you know, higher echelons of, of that particular sector, reputation. So what is it do you think, obviously. You know, as a sort of founder and a leader within that organisation, what is it you think that's kind of different to you guys than than others that have come into the sector of your success?

That's very kind, Ben, and I, I think there's a lot of, a lot of, lot of different things that make up this. We, firstly, we recruit only within animal related industries, so we are not a single desk in a bigger recruitment business. That does lots of other things.

Our pure focus is on animal-related industries. So that is animal health, equine, agriculture, and pet. And again, it's only for the supply industry to that.

So, sales, marketing, technical, customer service. I think that makes us very, very focused on what we're doing, and what we're able to offer because we really truly understand our clients' markets. The demands that are on our clients, but we get actually to spend the time with clients as well in there and really understand their culture, their ethos, their people, and their plans as well, not just what they're doing now, where do they want to be, what is their plan and then how can we help them find the people to get them there, because with the greatest drugs in the world, and the greatest nutritional products or, or whatever.

Or services, you need great people behind it to deliver it. So I think that's a lot of, of where we and our whole team get involved with that. Other than that as well, our people, I mean, absolutely it's crucial.

Our team of people are fantastic. I'm so proud of the team we have at Noble Futures. They're, they come from a very experienced background as well.

So we're not a recruitment business that hire fresh graduates to do a recruitment job. That's never been our model. We believe we need people out there who have, who have tread the boards, who understand the roles and who are able to have credible conversations with business leaders as well as candidates and being able to provide that.

Career advice. And in that, like, you know, our people are experienced at finding that special something, whatever it might be for each client and using their intuition to that, because that in itself, it is a challenge, and I, I know that challenge myself for recruiting my own team. I mean, there's lots of different things we're we're all extremely passionate about our industry and understand our industry as well.

So I think that that takes a lot and we care about what we do, and the people that we work with. Yeah, and I think that's it, and you know you very much have to be, you know, a people person to get to to know and to understand the people on the other end of the phone or on the other end of the street and that side of things. And of course, many vets and nurses are brilliant people, people, because we have to be because we spend.

All day every day engaging with the general public, but there is this perception that a lot of them that, you know, sort of when they get to a stage where, you know, they, they maybe want to look at a change outside of clinical practise and and have a look at industry that, you know, it's it's a move that is is very straightforward for them to make potentially, but obviously these are sometimes, you know, you can view these opportunities through rose tinted glasses, and are there any sort of, you know, brutal truths that people going from that sort of clinical cocoon. Need to be aware of when they consider that that move across into industry. I think it's it's a really good question.

There's there's so many different factors that can be taken in and it's all down to the individual as well that we're talking about the time. We do spend time as much as we can talking with candidates and helping them make that transition. We have done so as well internally.

Kay, one of our consultants is a qualified vet nurse who made the transition after, you know, 15 years and has worked then in in pharmaceutical account management. So has made that transition, as well as Barbara, who's somebody started out in the laboratory side of animal health, and made the transition over into commercial roles, on European levels as well. So, there's these people in the business are able to To give guidance, but going back, I suppose, to the question, it's not all about shiny cars, and I think and and sociables, and I think that's one of the pre the the differences that people have.

It's a lot down to your personal skill set as well as your own personality and your own drive. It it is a very different environment. Coming out of clinical practise and into a big commercial business or even a small or medium sized commercial business.

I think there's a little bit more awareness now of that with the corporatization that's gone on in that worlds, but going back in the early years, 1012 years ago, that was a, it was a major challenge just really getting candidate candidates to understand the different culture and the different expectations, that are on them. Yeah, and I think that's something that I, I remember the first conversation I ever had with you about a decade ago now, where it was like, look, you know, I'm, I'm looking at stepping out of equine practise into industry roles, and, and almost that sort of, like you say, the almost the naivety really is to, well, you know, it can't be much different to this, you know, it's just chatting about horses all of the time or or whatever that context was. Time and actually I think it was, you know, that best piece of advice that he gave me at the time was that, you know, this isn't the right time for you to be doing this, this is what you need to go and do.

And I think, you know, that is something that that does potentially make you stand out rather than taking the quick win of right, OK, let's find this person a job there, but knowing full well that actually 3 to 6 months down the line. They may not still gonna be in that role, you know, it's helping people to develop their, their sort of, you know, their, corporate acumen almost and say right, once you can do this, this and this, you can look into those avenues. But I I think obviously sometimes, you know, you do have to have these almost brutal conversations with people where it's like, look, you know, you're not the right person for this, or, or that side of things, or you know, maybe this isn't the right avenue for you.

To be considering, but how do you find that, you know, is that a challenge? I think at the end of the day it's, it's all about being honest and, and it's about being truthful. There's no point in, in not trying to get, it is a challenge, of course, but there's no point in not being honest and open, with what we know are the expectations and the requirements because they're given to us from the clients.

It's far more than what you can read in a job advert. We understand. What the client's needs are, as well as their own challenges internally.

And then the profile of people that are going to fit with that. So, it can be a challenge to get people to understand it, but about spending time with people and talking them through it, and hopefully with your own experience, And then that that's something that you, that you've reflected on there is by giving that time and just explaining it a little bit more and understanding it. Hopefully, people will get, get their own understanding, develop their own skills, or go out and learn new experiences as well before they come back.

On the flip side, we do talk with vets and nurses who actually come across great and are ready, but don't always have the confidence to make that move. So, That's a little bit of a different approach because we have somebody that we know or we that we think, are great for a role. They have everything that we want and what the client wants, but maybe they just don't have that inner confidence either to make that step.

So we spend time on that side also. But it's not. About forcing anybody to do the wrong thing, and we need to make that very clear.

We're not in this to make one hit deals. We are very much forming and farming long-term relationships with all our clients, and therefore our candidates. We could have candidates on our database for 6 days or 6 years.

It's, it is really that honest, that we have to make that approach and get the right fit for the client and the candidate. And to ensure success for everybody. And that's how our business grows.

Then that's, that's how our business is growing all the way along. It's not about getting the one hit and then walking away. It's about watching that person grow and developing their career.

It doesn't always work out, neither does any relationship in this world, not, not just an employer and employee relationship. It doesn't always work out, but we try and spend the time to get that match, as, as close as we can. And obviously, you know, you alluded to it earlier, you've had to build up your own team over that, that, that sort of, you know, last 18 years or so, and, you know, you'll have.

Successes, you'll have had failures in that time. But what, what maybe out of those experiences has helped you learn in order to help your own clients when they're looking like, have you ever had any circumstances where a company comes to you and says, oh, we're looking for this, this and this, and actually you may turn around and say, well, You know, actually, I think you're better looking for this rather than that in the circumstances that you're in. Yes, and but I think you've got to be very careful in trying to tell a client what what they want.

I think that's in any business, not just in recruitment. I think first you need to understand the client's needs, and understand why. They're giving you that brief, and what they're trying to achieve from that.

And because maybe I'm missing the point, or maybe we're missing the point sometimes. So we've got to really sit back, listen to what they're saying, try and picture it through their eyes, understand how they've come to that decision to hire that type of person. And then maybe talk around some experiences that we have.

We, we've, we've experienced lots of different highs and lows with with that. So it is very much about just sharing the idea and then maybe coming to an agreement that We will put a shortlist together, maybe will encompass what they've originally asked for, but also then maybe some suggestions as well. So maybe getting a right shortlist together, so not sending 5 of the same profile of candidates.

And obviously in in recent weeks, really, you know, the emergence of, of coronavirus and COVID-19 has has presented a massive challenge to to so many businesses across the. Across the board, and, and obviously, you know, people are reacting to it in different ways, but you know, Noble Futures is obviously your baby, and, and you know, it's, it's survived many things. It's survived recessions in the past, but, but, you know, has that presented new challenges for you for your work?

I mean, the last, it's been plenty of challenge, in the first two. 3 weeks of this has been very much on the defence and reacting to clients and candidates who are in very difficult situations. So, and supporting clients and candidates as best we can.

So, very much the beginning of this has been on the defence, and where I'm seeing now is actually it is forming different ways that we can support and Clients are using some of the tools that we've always had available, but maybe they didn't have to use, such as the video interviewing platforms and meeting rooms that we have available and like we're able to provide services such as pre-recorded first round interviews, video interviews with, with candidates and forward them over, that we can ask the client for their first, you know, 5 questions they'd like us to cover our first interview. And we find now that coming through this situation, clients are now taking this up, believe it or not, and currently. So yes, everything stopped, recruitment stopped for a couple of weeks, but it actually is now starting to pick up again.

And how we're doing it is different. So we're spending much more time over video and so are our clients. So actually I think in these terrible terrible situations, Some good things will come to this and new ways of working are going to come out of this.

Yeah, and I was gonna say, and you kind of feel like some of these changes are, you know, here to stay? Yes, they're a short term reactive measure, but at the same time, you know, will they shape how we, we evolve as a business moving forward? I mean, I don't have the magic ball, and I, I, I, I wish we did, but it's.

I think there's definitely going to be new ways of working. We've, we had clients, so going back pre-COVID-19, we had clients who would video interview all the, all do all the first round interviews over video, but then we had other clients who absolutely would not. And the differences in efficiency of those businesses and the recruitment process was evident to us, and we kind of shared that feedback as much as we can.

Clients as well, is that, you know, your time to recruit and the opening within your team, if you video interview can be much shorter because you don't need to diarize, you know, you've got 5 potential candidates, you've got 1 or 23 people internally that you need to line up to interview. Getting all those diaries in line to be in one place on the one day is a challenge. However, doing it over video, It it really cuts through that time.

It's amazing, it's an amazing time-saving tool. And also then you bring forward who you want to do the the second round interview and normally hire straight after that. Yeah, and I think, you know, that is, it's, it's really interesting looking at how different avenues in so many different business.

Are reacting but in a positive light, and you know, very much looking to the, you know, once we're through this, there will be a future and we do have to embrace that future and and move forwards with it rather than, you know, dig our feet in and and maybe kick back a little bit, . So obviously, you know, you've got a, a successful business, you, you know, I'm sure going to survive through COVID-19 and, and press on into the, into the future. So, you know, what, what success to, to you and to Noble futures in, in, in that future?

But success to me is always being happy, has to be number one, and we, we've got to be happy in what we do this. Yeah, there's enough challenges in our daily lives, both personally and professionally as well, that you, you must do something that makes you happy. And once I'm happy, then I believe that's the first tick to success.

Personally for me as a business owner, and, in recruitment, it's seeing others grow and succeed in their own lives, I get a great kick out of Watching my team grow and develop, and also seeing their success grow. And, in turn, I still get the same kick when we place the candidate. I'm aware of every candidate that's placed, in our business.

The team share it, we celebrate it, and we follow those candidates, through their career journey. And I get a genuine kick, the same way I did 16 years ago when I first started this. It is, it really is something that, That gets me, and for me that is evident for success, you know, if I can watch that, that's that's what it means to me.

Yeah, and if, if you're a vet or nurse listening to this and sort of saying, oh, you know. I've always thought about, you know, maybe contemplating a career in industry and different bits and bobs, along that along that avenue, and I have to say, you know, speaking to different friends and colleagues who are doing different things across the profession, you know, they're, they're often avenues that you never even contemplate until someone actually talks to you about it, you know, you don't even realise these opportunities exist. What sort of big three skills would you say were almost sort of paramount to to being at a level where you say, right, OK.

This person's ready to go from clinical practise into industry. That is, it's a very difficult question to answer because a lot of it comes down to the the client brief. Every client, that's one thing that I, I'm not avoiding the, the question, but if you are listening to this and considering it, don't rule it out on your own assumption.

You should definitely contact us or contact anybody else within, within the arena, to talk about your own experience because Every client is looking for something different. And I have to say that even though there could be a vet technical services across 10 different businesses, I can guarantee you some of the core stuff obviously that they do is, is the same thing, but each individual will have been hired for a different reason by each of those businesses. So, I think, you know, you can do lots of development and we see some vets really keep putting themselves through, academic development to try and improve.

Their business acumen or do an MBA or your certificate in marketing, that's no, that's fantastic, and we definitely recommend it. However, don't wait until all of that is done before you start having conversations with ourselves, or indeed with companies directing industry as well. About what they are looking for and because one company doesn't want you, it doesn't mean all of them don't want you.

Yeah, yeah, and I think that's something that, you know, people have got to just learn to, you know, kind of push at doors and speak to the right people out there say and say, you know, look, it might even be that people don't know what they're looking at, but they go and have a conversation with the likes of you or the likes of Kay or Chris, and sort of say, well, actually, do you know, have you, have you ever thought about these kind of things and I'm a huge advocate of, you know, if you don't ask, you don't get, . Absolutely. And I think that's key, like, you know, everybody in the team is different, in our team.

Kay, Chris, Barbara, they all come from different backgrounds and they all offer something different. And that's one of the key things, and I think if you can identify that we're able to have different conversations with different people, and offer different advice, each one of them will be able to offer different advice, definitely. Well, I think that's all, I think that gives people a great insight into sort of, you know, the extent of of things that you do behind the scenes with Noble Futures, not just the sort of, you know, look, send us your CV and we'll forward it to every Tom, Dick and Harry that we know.

It's very much an invested relationship, and I certainly know from, you know, my own experiences and seeing those of others that you've, certainly helped a lot of people, finding their, their ways, as you say, to, to, to be happy at work essentially. Yeah, so, on that, then, yeah, just so it's clear, I think, you know, that we, we do not send out CVs willy-nilly at all. We actually will only ever send your CV to a job brief that we have discussed in full with you.

That's the approach we take. We don't market candidates out openly. We believe you are a brand and you need to, to protect yourself like that brand also.

Yeah, and I think that kind of speaks volumes really as to the, you know, the values of the company. And you know, obviously that extrapolates down from yourself. So I think, Tony, thank you so much for the conversation.

I'm, I'm really looking forward to getting this out to people. Because I think obviously off the back of this, when people have got a lot of time with their thoughts, I dare say that people are gonna be looking to their futures and contemplating things, so I would highly recommend, you know, that's something that is, is sort of just niggling away at the back of your brain to, you know, have a chat with Tony or one of the team, because I'm, I'm fairly sure that, you know, you, you would be surprised by the opportunities that are out there for you. Definitely.

Thanks, Ben. And I just like to like leave a message to everybody during these times that it is uncertain, there are going to be different job roles coming through at the end of this, and, and businesses are going to be operating differently. All my recommendation is for anybody who is being furloughed or it's just in these uncertain times is to keep yourself ready, you know, keep developing yourselves as you can.

There's plenty of online courses that people can do to learn a new thing and develop yourself, to come out. Of this game ready, as they say in, in the football game, and I'm not a football supporter at all, is that, you know, footballers in the offseason don't go in line of each. They come back match fit and match ready.

So it is something that I think we all need to pay attention to that, to keep developing ourselves. So when we come back from this, we're ready to go. I think that's about as good advice as you can get is that, you know, make sure that when you come back, you're coming back match fit.

So I think, yeah, we'll definitely find that to go on a fridge magnet. But, that's brilliant. Tony, thank you so much for your time, as ever, it's always great chatting, it's weird doing it in a formal capacity, but, I know, I know how passionate you are about everything and helping everybody, so thank you very much.

Thanks, Ben. Take care.