Hello, everybody. And welcome back to vet chat. Today I am super excited to be bringing you another podcast focusing on women's health as part of our goal to support women in the veterinary profession.

Joining me today is Marlo Cornelson, who is the founder of period reality. And as you would probably expect from the name of her company today we are gonna be talking about periods and our menstrual cycles. But before we get started, let me tell you a little bit about our guests.

Marlow has over a decade of experience in creating a positive impact in the social sector. She transitions out of the CEO global charity role with the company World Merit, where she managed strategic partnerships positively impacting 450,000 people annually. Through this work and building the foundation blocks for period reality, she has established a vast network based often on deep personal relationships with people committed to supporting period reality's work.

These relationships range from people representing companies like Google and institutions like the Her and NASA and large social entrepreneurship networks like the Skull Foundation and the Opportunity collaboration. She has spoken at some of the most prestigious global venues, including the British House of Parliament, the United Nations headquarter and the Vatican. Finally, she holds a master's degree in health, economics, policy and law from the Erasmus University in Rotterdam.

So welcome, Marlow. Thank you. Thank you.

That was a very extensive introduction. Thank you so much for being here. As I mentioned in the intro, the Webinar vet are so passionate about supporting women in the veterinary profession.

And I think there is just still this taboo around periods and and, you know, I think this conversation is really gonna help. So thank you so much for joining me. Very welcome.

Very excited to be here to get us started. Should we go back to basics? Do you mind just explaining to our listeners what is a menstrual cycle?

Yeah. Well, I think if you have been lucky enough to get any type of education around your menstrual cycle in school, it's very likely that the focus would have been on your period. You know, the few days a month that you may bleed.

And then if you've been very lucky, they may have mentioned ovulation to you. And that's obviously both are part of a very biological process that happens in your body on a monthly, on a monthly cycle. But the idea is that, by the way, that your hormones are designed and fluctuate throughout the month, there's not a single day in your cycle that your hormones are balanced the same way.

So as you can imagine, you know, hormones influence so much within our body and the way we show up and the way we feel and the way our body functions. So just to think that that is never the same throughout the month. But the kind of expectation that we show off feeling the same way every day or you know, are just as productive or confident or happy.

You know, that's obviously, you know, not a very realistic thing to kind of assume based on what's biologically happy happening in your body. So what we are looking at is really with what's going on hormonally, you know, how can we make that more visible and relate that to to what we are experiencing both physically as well as in our in our day to day life? And the way we can look at that is, I think from a starter perspect perspective.

Even if you look at two phases, you know, one half of the month when you're as you are approaching your menstruation and and going through your your period, that is more of like your inner phase. So you like to retract from the world, be by yourself. You know your body needs that energy to kind of move through those phases.

A lot of people will appreciate that metaphor if I just want to snuggle up on the sofa with my blanket and a cup of tea. So it's much more about, like that inner kind of phasing phase of of your month, whereas as you're coming out of your period, your oestrogen levels are rising and you're moving into, ovulation. That's often when you are a lot more outward looking from a biology perspective, that makes sense because when you're ovulating, nature wants you to go out and make babies.

So you know that's really the time that you'd like to be around people you like to socialise. Often. This is where women feel like they have a good hair day, You know, miraculously, they woke up that day and had a good hair day.

Feel confident, like all of those things. So it's a lot more about other people, and that energy is a lot more outward facing. So, that's kind of a way to look at.

It appeared reality. We look at it at the four faces. So we really break down that you know, your your menstruation as a face coming out of that your ve phase as you move into your ovulation as the third phase and then the fourth phase being the one where you move back into, your period and each of those phases come with a set of, you know, strengths, preferences needs, you know, skills that you can leverage throughout the month that help you live more in sync with those biological rhythms that you may be experiencing with your fluctuating hormones.

OK, it's fascinating, isn't it? There's all this, all these things just happening, and we're not even aware half the time. I think to have that self-awareness is really important, isn't it?

Yeah, definitely. And and it's something that we're so far removed from as well. You know, just knowing what's going on in our body, what our body needs.

If you start paying attention to it, you'll find that, for example, your body might be needing different types of foods. So as you move into your period and during your period, the the kind of rule of thumb is keep your womb warm. So it's like the soups and the stews and the root products and things that are really good and nurturing for your body As again like your body is moving through these phases of, you know what it is doing and shedding the uterine lining and getting your body ready for your period and moving through that, but, you know, back in the days we would just eat what our body was craving, and I think, you know, in the day and time that we live in now we're so used to just eating what we're eating on a daily basis, and you might be on a health streak and being like healthy or whatever.

But there's it. We're very far removed from being able to listen to our body when it tells us what is actually craving. And sometimes, you know, this level of awareness can then help you get yourself a little bit closer to your body so that you start to learn and appreciate what you can, do best to support your body as it's moving through these different phases each month.

Yeah, OK, Brilliant. And what was it in that, you know, made you really focus on, like, cycle awareness and form period reality? Well, I saw something on an instagram story with, like a friend of a friend, and she talked about the four different seasons of your cycle and being in, like, inner winter.

And I flicked through it. And then I came back and I was like, What's that? And I'm originally from the Netherlands, So I thought, I'm I'm from a country where we have good access to education.

We're quite an open minded country as well. So surely, if this was a thing, I would have known about it. At the time, I was CEO of of a charity.

I had no intention of leaving my job whatsoever. So it was just a curiosity that I was following. And as I figured out it was a thing.

I got more and more frustrated than you know. It's something that I wasn't aware of, but with me probably, you know, millions of others. And then the first hit I got on Google was a book called The Optimised Woman.

And then that just pissed me off. Honestly, because I just you know, I was in this mindset of like, Oh, imagine, like you could be so much healthier, happier if you knew all this. And then the first hit I got was a way to make me more productive for society rather than just a healthier, happier self, so that I think that most ideas are born out of a frustration, isn't it or an anger?

And that's kind of what then fueled me to look into it further, and we spend a good two years actually really researching the landscape. And the last thing I wanted to do, especially with my background in the social sector, is come into space and overcrowded. I wanted to make sure there was an opportunity here, and I realised that no one is really talking about this on a global scale, and the people who are talking about it, mostly in northern Europe, North America are talking about it in a very non inclusive way.

So even referring to the Four Seasons, that doesn't translate geographically. You know, a summer here and a summer in Australia is very different. And at the same time, the language was a lot around celebrating your period and seeing it as a superpower.

And through my previous work, I knew of, like girls in India were being locked away in a goat shed for a week, a month, you know, countries where this is obviously such a taboo topic. So I wanted to make sure. I think knowing this and having this information is everyone's birthright.

And we need to make sure we get this out to every single person on the planet. And we realise the only way to do that that is through storytelling. And that's kind of where we came up with the name period reality as well that if we allow a space and a platform for people to share about their reality, others may be able to find relatability in that, and that can kind of then facilitate a conversation.

And that's where the education and the learning can happen. In a way that it kind of transcends. You know, cultures, age, race, all of these things.

But just coming from a place of of authentic storytelling. And that's kind of how period reality was born. Amazing.

I love it. I think it's fantastic. So how far?

How long ago did all this happen? When? So this.

So this I came that instagram post was probably in, like, April of 2020. And then So that's kind of when we started doing the research. And then I had a little nine month maternity break in between when I had my second daughter.

And then I came back, left my previous job. I actually didn't go back into my previous job after my second maternity leave and to do this full time. So, yeah.

Wow. Fantastic. Are you currently looking for a new role?

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We offer a tailored recruitment guidance to help you secure a dream permanent role. And we run locums payroll too, which is free for the locums to use visit. Simply vets.com to find out how we can help back to the talking about our cycles.

So do are there some common misconceptions that you hear a lot about periods and our and your, menstrual cycles? Yes. And I think that's a very, you know, even that in itself is kind of like a sensitive question, isn't it?

Because for some people, what is taboo or misconception is very different than than for the other. I think from my perspective, the fact that in in certain countries, it's still being seen as taboo, impure, You know that you're not allowed to go to school when you are on your period or you're not allowed to be in the same room. People who travel might have experienced that they're not allowed to go into a certain, religious building.

When they're on their period. They're literally asked to like, stay outside. You know, all of that is really fascinating to me, Especially when you think that, you know, you either have a menstrual cycle, but you're definitely born from one you know, if your mom didn't have a cycle, you wouldn't be here today.

So it's, you know, it is one of the most natural processes in the world. And then equally you hear stories about, there's this great article about the tribal community in California, and girls on their periods aren't allowed to go to school either. But it's kind of from the opposite perspective.

So during that week they're really seen as divine and celebrated and, like, cater to and really, you know, looked after. So it's just you know it. It just goes to show how embedded this conversation is in culture, and, you know that it's really some people say, you know, it's from it differs so much from country to country, and we always say it's actually household to household because whatever your grandmother told your mother is what your mother told you.

And even in the UK, when we talk about you know what's a normal cycle and you know what are normal symptoms and how much pain is normal. How much blood loss is normal, like the only parameters you probably have are the ones that are being passed down from your family? So even from household to household.

There can be a huge difference in how people perceive menstruation or the cycle. And, you know, just going back to the fact that it's the most natural process that's happening. You know, So I think it's worth finding out what it's all about.

And, you know, like I said before, it's that birthright that we feel every single person on the planet should at least know what's going on in their own body. You know? It's ours.

Yeah, absolutely. And I guess age also plays a part, doesn't it? Because at school, it wasn't really talked about with me like my little girl.

You know, is in primary school, and I believe they do little bits. But again, it's only focused on periods, not your full cycle. So I guess there's a lot more that schools can do as well.

Isn't there just to educate Children 100% Children and staff? And I mean, you know, if we think about how we treat teachers, you know, very often schools tell teachers Oh, you have to do your parent teacher evenings this week. You know, you've been given the slots this week is when all of that needs to happen.

And imagine when you know you're going through your menstruation. You're physically struggling. You may have cramps, you know, loss of focus, low energy, low mood.

All of those things you've just been teaching from, like, you know, eight or nine till four. Then you have these back to back 10 minutes, conversations till seven. At night, the whole week.

You know, you're doing a disservice to the school, to the parents, to the Children if you're running on empty, You know, for a school even to think about that in a more flexible way of like, you pick your week. You know, within this month, all the all the parent teacher evening conversations need to have happened. But you pick a week where you're, like, high in energy, and you've got that extra little bit to give.

You know, So there's there's so many structural systems and processes we're all part of that is just not really designed for the way you know, people with with menstrual cycles show up. Yeah. No.

Absolutely. And do you think tracking your cycle plays a key part in like women understanding their bodies. I mean, it's the first step.

It is the very first step. And we we just talked a little bit about, you know, attuning to your body and learning its language. And that doesn't happen if you don't support that process.

And the way to support that process is by cycle tracking. And and sometimes that can be quite an overwhelming thing to people. Because, you know, what do you track?

How do you start? But so we always say, Just start very lightly. If you have never tracked before, You know, just start by noting down when your period starts and when it finishes how long your cycle is on average, you know just those basic things.

If you then want to add to that, you can start maybe journaling. There's lots of apps out there you can use as well, but just write one or two sentences each day about how you're feeling what's showing up for you. We found a lot of people have been able to kind of predict when they have headaches or migraines or cramps.

So imagine that you'd be able to know when those things happen for you, so you can plan life around it. But you can layer all of that on. You know, if if cycle tracking is something that overwhelms you, then you know the the key really is to start simple.

We've developed a cycle tracking template that I'd love to share with all the listeners as well, which just says, pick two or three things each month that you want to track. So let's say you want to track your confidence and how focused you are and how happy you feel right, and you just score each of these things a number 1 to 10 each day. So just before you go to bed, you just give it a number, and then you plot it in a graph so that the sheets that we've created allows for the writing down the numbers and plotting the graph.

And you can see for these three things kind of what the trend is. And we believe if you do that on a daily basis for three months in a row, you'll be able to start seeing trends arise of like, Oh my gosh, this is what my confidence is doing. And this is what my focus is doing and this is how happy I feel.

And all of that can then be leveraged in some decisions that you make around. You know how you show up personally and professionally, when you plan certain things. But also, if you're forced to do something that requires you to feel confident when you're really not to at least be kind to yourself, you know and say, I'm going to deliver this presentation today it's going to feel different than if I would have done it two weeks ago or, you know, in two weeks time.

But I'm still going to try my best. And I'm going to give myself Grace because I appreciate where I am in my cycle. And, you know, I'm forcing my body to do something that it's not really, wanting to do at this part of the month.

So, yeah, I think it's cycle tracking is hugely important because the more you then do it, the more you get back in touch with with your body and the way it's trying to communicate with you, and it will be more and more easy over time to do that intuitively. OK, fantastic. And yeah, as you said, even just jotting down a few points.

You know, just for three months. It's not gonna take you loads of time, but it could have a huge, you know, positive impact, couldn't it? On how you're feeling and and you mentioned women's health at the beginning.

It's fascinating to me that when we introduce this concept to women, there's hardly ever anyone who doesn't understand the importance of it. And if you go to the GP, we believe your menstrual cycle should be like your sixth vital sign. It should be what what GPS ask you, You know, whatever is wrong with you, they they need to be asking more, because if there's anything wrong in your body, it's very likely that it's going to express itself in a difference in your cycle.

But how do you know that there's a difference if you don't know what your baseline is? You know, so women seem to really understand the importance of cycle tracking and having these insights and data into their own health. But then, to get women to cycle track is really difficult, you know, because you said it's not a lot.

It's just a little bit each day, you know, starting off for three months. But that's a huge commitment. And then I think that feeds into some of the societal frameworks again, like the systems that we work in, that we're so not used to taking that moment for self care or that moment to prioritise yourself and carve out that time.

And then again like that, that feels like a real commitment. Doing something every day for three months, you know, Whereas we all agree it's important. So surely that shouldn't be a hard sell.

But that's yeah, that's fascinating to me that it's, yeah, Women often need a little bit of convincing to get to it, but I promise you it'll be. It'll be so worth it. Yeah, and you think about the amount of time that you just kind of sit there and scroll on your phone, you know, and you even if you're just using two minutes at that time, just a note in your phone like you know, it's not.

When you think about it and break it down, it's really not that big a commitment is it to to just do. But yes, we will definitely if you've got examples or any frameworks that might be useful that any of our listeners might wanna, take a look at we can post them, you know, with all our promotions around this podcast, and then people can access them. Amazing.

Yeah, I'll definitely do that. OK, fantastic. And what sort of projects are period reality working on at the moment?

So we're doing a lot of work with organisations and businesses, to talk about menstrual equity in the workplace and how businesses can be more supportive. Both from a supportive perspective, but also from a how can we leverage, the more of, like, 28 day cycle and the the strengths that come up around that to, you know, to focus on better outcomes, more streamlined processes and things like that. Again, if we go back to that example for presentation, it would also be in, you know your work's best interest if they let you present at a time where you feel very confident and articulate and you know you're going to smash that presentation rather than to ask you to do it when you have that massive imposter syndrome and think, you know, why did they even hire me in the first place?

And those are real feelings and emotions that you experience right One day a month, you could be like, I need a raise and I want a promotion. And then two weeks later, you might go like, No, don't even know why I am here, You know, So and all of that is valid. And I think, you know, there's so much, so much to be gained by involving workplaces into these conversations.

But we also do a lot of work in communities. So we run a programme here in Liverpool in, house with young moms who have nowhere else to go. So we talk to talk to them about, you know, if you feel sad one day, that might just not be forever.

You know, it might just happen to be where you are in the month and again, just understanding that that fluctuates. But we also do work. We've just done a programme around International Women's Day in the slums in Pakistan.

We're going to Nairobi in June to work with communities, different sets of communities as well. So, you know, both focused on period poverty, but then also, doing some work with the LGBT Q community. We do some work with the disability community.

So it's really trying to find that wholesome approach of how do we engage workplaces? Academia? The medical sector, you know, charities.

Everyone around this conversation, like you said, educational institutions to really think about, you know, how do we change the systems in the world that we live in to move away from this, you know, 24 hour cycle that we're so used to kind of be in and lean more into that, you know, more monthly cycle. That is our our natural cycle, and that requires some system level change, and that needs all of us to kind of show up for that. So that's what we're trying to, to to demonstrate and and, amplify through the programmes that we do.

Yeah. Fantastic. No, I think it's absolutely incredible.

And I bet do you do you see a lot of like success stories from people kind of within the period reality community who are kind of embracing their cycles and kind of you know everything that you're all about. Yeah, absolutely. And that can range from like someone saying I had my first day of work and before going in, I knew it wasn't the best time for me to have my first day at work because I was bloated.

I was a little bit insecure. You know, I was aware of what I was wearing, how you know. And I knew I needed to make lots of small talk and, you know, have that again, like outward facing energy when that when that's not really what I'm feeling inside.

But just knowing that before I came in really helped me kind of navigate those that energy and that those emotions throughout the day, we've had stories from women who have been diagnosed with cysts, and they only realised that was going on because they started paying attention to their cycle. People are working towards certain athletic or like sports goals who were so used to being on this PT programme, where you know, every day you just increase your reps rather than thinking about There are certain times of the month that you need to be engaging in certain type of activities. And then over a month, you know, you'll have done whatever possible to get to your best, you know, outcome in terms of training, but just doing the same thing every day again.

It's just not really how we're built. So, even that in terms of, like, smashing some PBS on on, you know, lifting or whatever. And see that really improve when you start to train more according to your cycle.

So it just again even the success stories range, across all different kind of sectors and ways that it impacts our lives. Yeah, absolutely fantastic. And just finally, I know we're quickly running out of time, But if people, are really keen to, like support period reality or to get involved, what's the best way for them to do that?

I would say reach out and get inside. Bring us into your workplace. We're always happy to talk with organisations who wanna promote menstrual equity in the workplace.

We can come in and do a training. We're always looking for champions. So just individuals who want to, you know, help us spread the words we set ourselves a goal of reaching 1 billion people by 2030 so we can use all the help we can get.

And then finally, we're a charity as well. So a lot of the work we do in community is through donations and grants. So if anyone feels compelled to make a donation, those are always very welcome as well.

Fantastic. And is it period reality.org?

Is that the best place for people to find out more? That's it. Yeah.

Oh, well, thank you so much for joining me. Well, is there anything else that you wanted to, get across to our listeners that we might not cover today? Definitely not.

I think you know, thank you so much for for having me. I hope we planted some seeds today and sparked some curiosity around cycle awareness. And, yeah, please do reach out if anyone has any questions.

Oh, thank you so much. It's been fascinating. Really enjoyed talking to you.

Thank you so much. Thanks a lot. Bye.