Hello everybody, and thank you so much for joining us for another episode of Vet Chat. Our guest today, who I'm very, very excited to be joined by, is Kat Hensbridge. Cat graduated from Bristol Veterinary School in 2003 and has always worked in first opinion small animal practise.

Her passion is working collaboratively with owners to ensure their pet receives the care they need, and she's created a website full of pet advice, Catheett.com. From there she started to blog and created social media pages to share her work and things that she felt was important in the pet world.

She is now very well known in the profession and is incredibly proud to be a passionate advocate of all her colleagues, their work, and the animals we care for. So welcome Kat, thank you so much for joining us. Well thank you very much for having me.

I'm delighted to be here. Brilliant. So today we're gonna have a little chat about finding the balance between motherhood and work, which is.

It's definitely a juggle. I can tell you myself from personal experience. Did you want to start just by telling us a little bit about your family, please?

Yes, so I have 3 children. They are Alice, who is 4, Felicity, who is 8, and Christopher who is 10. And I live just outside Sheffield in the north of England, and this is my hometown, so I'm very fortunate in the fact that I have quite a significant amount of family around me, which does make balancing work and life much easier.

My husband is also a vet. So we are a bit of a cliche in that, in that respect. We were at university together, but I do like to point out that we didn't get together until after we graduated, so we weren't one of those like annoying university couples.

Lovely though they are, I always feel like that's, that's, that's like a point I really feel like I need to make every time. So we're both in the profession which. I actually think it's quite helpful because I think it, it means that we kind of know what, what each other is going through and we can support each other and, and understand, you know, vet life, so, but yes, I can't, I don't, I definitely, definitely don't do it alone.

I have a, I have a lot of help. Brilliant, that's great. So your eldest is 10, did you say?

Yeah, yeah, so they're currently all in primary school, all three are at. I reached parental Nirvana in September when all three went to school because it was really lovely hanging out with the little one, but. You know, the pandemic put the kibosh on so much.

So we did miss out on like lots of little playgroups and stuff, which was a bit of a shame, but to be honest, I have been going to playgroups for decades, so I wasn't too upset, and now to have them, to have all three at school is amazing, so, so great. Yeah, much easier to coordinate, I imagine. Brilliant.

So just going back to when you had your eldest son, how were those first few years as a, as a new mother and as a vet as well? So, they, I think motherhood hits you like a tonne of bricks, doesn't it? It doesn't really matter how much you think you're prepared, you're not.

And certainly when I had Christopher, I bought quite a few books about how to be pregnant and you know, how to give birth and how to, you know, sail through the process. And I was very fortunate. I had very, very easy pregnancies and relatively speaking quite easy births as well.

So I, I did come through that process without, you know, too much trauma. But then when I had him, what I realised is I actually didn't own any books about how to parent. I just bought them I sort of had forgotten that, you know, at the end of pregnancy, you know, this next phase would start.

So it was, I mean, it's always a challenge, and I've never been blessed with children who've enjoyed sleeping when they were little, so it was, it, it is, it is very difficult, and I think it's only when you come out of the other side, you know, out of those really early months and, and look back that you realise that you were actually. A bit you'd actually gone mad. I definitely went mad for a bit and you know, if you'd have asked me at the time, I'm like, no, no, I'm perfectly fine, completely fine, absolutely fine.

Nothing wrong. I've got this, I'm fine. And then you look back and you just think I was, I was like running on no sleep.

I was full of coffee and Diet Coke and wine because I hadn't been able to drink, you know, and I was just like living edge. I was clinging to life by my fingertips, but you know, it, it was only afterwards that I realised that. Mm.

I actually went back to work really early, and it's not something that I would recommend. But again, at the time, I was like, this is completely fine. I've got a baby, but I'm so professional and I'm gonna be able to manage it all.

It's gonna be great, and it's not a problem. This child is just, I was a little bit like, well, if the women in Africa can strap the babies to their backs and carry on in the field, then I can keep going. You know, so I seem to, I've really, I didn't like feel like I had something to prove, but.

I was just like, this isn't gonna slow me down. And at the time I was locuming and, and was, had been locuming for quite a while and so got offered some jobs when he was quite little. And instead of doing the sensible thing and saying, do you know what, there'll still be a job in 6 months' time.

I'm gonna take some time out and say no, I said yes. So I did my first shift of locuming when he was 6 weeks old, Christopher, bearing in mind that. You know, he didn't believe in sleeping.

And looking back, I just, I don't know how, I don't know how I managed it, and I, I think the people that I was working for must have just thought I was absolutely bonkers. And then after, when he was about maybe 3 or 4 months old, I went, I went back and did a 2.5 day a week.

Work for 2.5 days a week and You know, I don't do that. Don't follow my example, don't, don't do that.

Again, you know, at the time I could have said I was absolutely fine and you know, I was pumping breast milk in the consult room just saying to the nurses, if you need to come in, you're very welcome, but it will be pumping and you know, there's a bottle of milk in the fridge, but don't drink it because it's babies for babies, . But Yeah, somehow I came, so you just do it, you know, when you're a parent, you just, you just get whatever life throws at you, you just get on with it, and it's, I think it's sometimes it's only when you stop that you just, you just realise that, it, you know, we maybe didn't need to do it like that, so maybe it could have been done a bit differently. So when he was 6 weeks old, you went back to 2.5 days a week, locumin, did you have some support at home to, to look after your son, or did you?

Yeah. Yeah, I did. I had, well, I had loads at the time we weren't actually living in Sheffield, we were living in Shropshire, where we didn't have any family.

But we were very, very fortunate that I found an amazing childminder, who took him. It it was, I think 6 weeks was just a Saturday morning, it was probably about maybe 3 months old when I went back to 2.5, 2.5 days a week.

And, she looked after him from there, so I would just give her like little packets of breast milk. And she and her husband, the, the childminder, have actually become like really good, really close friends now, and they're, they're actually the children's godparents. So I was just fantastically fortunate to find someone who would, who would take him so young.

And, and yes, I had, yeah, I had a, I had a lot of support, but I mean, looking back, you know. What on earth was I doing with the other two, with the, the two, the one who's 8 and the one who's 4, I still didn't have super long maternity leaves because actually, while I, when I had children, I've I've locumed the entire, I have actually got employed, I am actually employed now, I actually do have an actual job, but at the time I was locumming and it, it wasn't so much that I went back because we needed like the money or anything. I definitely probably could have taken more time off, but it was more the fact that.

I think when you're kind of self-employed there is that pressure to go back and to get into it and to not miss out on jobs and to keep, you know, yourself ticking over, so with the girls, both of them I had about 6 months, but there is this real. Issue, I think of, of women leaving the profession or certainly having maternity leave and then going back in, you know, you can deskill really, really easily, or at least we think we will deskill really quickly, you know, so like staring down the barrel of a of a big fat bitch bay when you've not picked up a scalpel blade for a year is fantastically intimidating and and it was one of the factors why I went, why I went back so. So soon, but at the end of the day, I don't think it actually benefited me at all.

I don't, you know, now, you know, well 4 years down the line or 3 years down the line from when I last did it, I don't think I'm in any different a position than if I hadn't done that, or if I had, you know, if I had taken a year out or 18 months out, I don't think it would have made, I would be in the same position I am now as I was then, so. You know, I think a lot of women do worry about career breaks and there is a lot of stress around, am I going to be OK when I go back, and yeah, there is a bit of a, you know, you do get on a bit of a learning curve, but you know, if you've been in practise a reasonable length of time. You quite quickly get back on the bike.

Yeah. Did it feel when you went back after having your children, did you feel any different as a vet? Or did it just kind of, did you just naturally go back into, you know, everything that you'd always known, or did, did you do, you know, actually feel quite different in yourself?

I think it made me more sympathetic towards clients and their like. Restrictions on their lives. Like when, you know, when people say to you, you say, can I, can you bring him in on Tuesday?

And they say, oh no, I can't possibly bring you in on Tuesday. Tuesday's my shopping day. Like, well, I think you could probably, you know, maybe you could shop on a Wednesday and bring him in on Tuesday.

And you know, there's this like, people live their lives to a rhythm, and. It, it did make me more like, well, I can't possibly come in on Wednesday, you know, Wednesday is playgroup, and that's sacrosanct or, you know, Wednesdays when I do my weekly shop. So I do feel I did was a bit more sympathetic towards that and I'm a bit nicer with kids.

Like I was never horrible with children, but I didn't, you know, I think before you have children you don't really understand them. And you're like, you're a tiny person who's like knocking around my consult room, and I was gonna be polite, but I don't really understand you as, you know, whereas now I'm a lot more chilled out with children in the consult room and, and also with parents, and I think it gives you something. It gives you something in common with a lot of people as well, you can say, oh yes, I know when my kid's that, or you know it's like when your kids do this, when your animals do that.

And you know, having that commonality and that ability to sort of talk to people, I think, I think it has really helped with that. That's not to say that, you know, vets without children aren't aren't equally able to consult with clients, but I think it does give you some . You know, if you can find some common ground, I think that makes our lives a lot easier.

Yeah, no, completely agree. I remember before I had my girls, I used to think people were crazy that, you know, remember one of my friends wouldn't meet me between like 12 and 2 because that was nap time. And I used to think.

You know, can you just not meet me like for a, you know, a second of that? Or, and it was, it was, now it all makes sense. You know, you've got that 2 hour nap time where you can get everything else that you need to get done done.

But before having children, that wouldn't make any sense to you. Yeah, I completely agree. Absolutely not.

And I, I always strive to, to be a routine parent, I never was. I used to have, I did have some girlfriends with babies, and they were very wedded to Gina Ford and it was like, It's 5 and we have to go, we have to go now because she must nap in 2, you know, 20 minutes, she has to be asleep. And I was, I, I was, and I think that's probably one of the reasons why they didn't sleep is because I tried, but to be honest, I was like, well, I'd rather sit in a cafe and drink some coffee for an extra half an hour than take the baby home for a nap.

So I'll pay for it later, but right now, I just don't care. So, yeah, I've never been, I've never been one to stick to a regime, unfortunately. So before you became a mother, were you, anxious at all or, you know, worried about having children because of your job and you know, how you might balance your time?

Not really. I've always been quite, like quite a relaxed and pragmatic person, you know, sort of one of these, well, I'm sure it'll all work out in the end. And I didn't actually work with many mothers as, as a vet, but I did have one colleague who was a parent and she was really great to work with, you know, cos she balanced, I watched her balance motherhood and children quite well, and, you know, every so often one tips into the other.

I remember one day she brought her little boy into the practise, cos she wanted to go and see a client, and he didn't have anyone else to look after him, and I was completely mystified. By this child and, you know, I think by the time she came back an hour later I'd kind of fed him like 20 custard creams cos he didn't know what else to do and he kept saying, can I have a biscuit? And I kept saying, well, OK, fine, if that's gonna keep you quiet, you know, but I've also had some really great role models in the fam my family.

My mother is a GP, so there's a lot of parallels there between that and first opinion vetting. And well she's the one that gave me the idea. She went back to work as a GP when I was 6 weeks old.

So I did have some precedents and and potentially some like little voice in my head saying, well, your mother did it, so why can't you? And she's balanced, you know, full-time doctoring with, I'm one of 3 girls, with bringing us up, . Without, I mean, it's a bit swan like, you know, she sort of sails serenely along on the surface, but as a kid you do miss a lot of the paddling underneath.

And she, you know, and she was sometimes she was a bit of a disaster like we often got left behind at things because she forgot that we were there or was a bit late for pick up and whatnot. But on the whole, she did a great job, and all my family is full of working mothers. My aunts, you know, are all working.

So I, I'm the eldest of my sisters and cousins. So I was the first one of my generation to have children within my family unit. So I had no one of my own generation to look to, but the generation previously had managed it without a problem.

Oh, seemingly, so I had that as well to look at and think, you know, this is completely, you know, just very normal in my world to be a working mother in a professional capacity and manage it. And did you, one thing that a lot of people, struggle with is obviously the balance, but then also being present and, you know, being able to switch off and enjoy that time with your family when you're with them. Is that something that you've ever struggled with?

I think it's inevitable, isn't it, that when you have a job like being a vet, which carries quite a significant amount of responsibility, that your life, your home life and your work life bleed into each other, and you do take one with you where, you know, wherever you go, and especially if things are, you know, it's, I think it more happens when things start to go wrong at work, you know, maybe you're dealing with a complaint or maybe you had a mistake or maybe you had a really bad day. To come home from that or to, you know, the next day if I'm not at work, deal with the kids, but there's always those thoughts ticking along in the background. So it is hard to separate and I think, One thing I've kind of learned is to not try too hard to separate them, and to accept, you know, people talk of like work-life balance as if they're two separate things, but actually they're part of the whole and I sort of try and, I was talking to someone recently about, you know, maybe we should consider it work-life synergy, you know, and they work together.

Alongside each other. But yes, I think it is hard to not think about cases when you're at home and, and obviously because I do the social media side of things and I'm, I'm often, you know, posting on the internet and that sort of thing, that side of my life does bleed into my home life for sure. And sometimes I have to make a real effort to to switch it off, but definitely, absolutely, that makes, that makes sense.

And when you when you went back into, you know, practise after having your family, were, were they quite flexible with you? Did you, did you feel like they were quite good at, you know, supporting you through the, the change going back to, to work? So, I think my experience is probably gonna be different to a lot of people's because I was locuming at the time and when I had, Well, all three of my children actually, my locuming has always been.

For like a small number of regular clinics rather than a different job every two weeks. So they knew me well and they, you know, they supported me through pregnancies and, and all of that and, well, like I say, because I had easy pregnancies, and, and also quite a relaxed attitude towards things. I wasn't too fussed about, you know, I mean, obviously health and safety is important, but, you know, I think some pregnant women worry more about it than others, like, for example, my sister, who I love dearly and she's my best friend, but my goodness, she's a hypochondriac, and when she was pregnant with her first.

That, you know, the problems, she, she's also a vet, and the problems that she thought about, you know, the fuss that she made over some different things in, in the practise, and, like, I, I cannot even tell you. And I was just like, oh, she'll be absolutely fine. I'll just not gas down any guinea pigs, and life can go on.

So I didn't really cause too many problems, but also, I wasn't in a position where I maybe really could have done anyway. And then when I went back, To a certain extent, I sort of said to them, I can do this day, this day, but not this day, and the the clinics were OK with that. But I did work full vet days and that was the other reason why I was so lucky in finding this childminder.

I, I actually didn't have to dictate to them, when I had to finish and when I had to leave by. Because this amazing childminder, who's now the children's godparents was just super relaxed about when I could get them. So I would regularly go and collect them at like 7 o'clock or 7:30 from her house.

And then she and I would have a couple of glasses of wine and then I would take them home. She lived next door, like she, she did not live far away, I didn't have half a bottle of wine and then pile the kids in the car, . So I think that was handy that it was, it was amazing.

It was a bit like, you know, an amazing thing. So I think my experiences, especially in that at those early years were just not normal, and I appreciate how lucky I am because I think that, you know, as a parent, you suddenly do have loads. Of other responsibilities and you know nursery kicks them out at 6 p.m.

On the dot. And if you are late for nursery pick up, you're gonna be fined an enormous amount, or you know, your little child's gonna be there like a little refugee with their coats on and their bag on, and, you know, they're desperate to get rid of them. So the pressure for pickup is something that I've always been very fortunate to never really have to, to struggle with.

We've always had our kids with childminders. When we moved back to Sheffield, That was a bit of a shock to the system because the first childminder that I used was strict about pickup, and that was the first time I had really had to go. I have to leave and I have to leave now.

And it is really difficult when you are part of a team and the team needs you or there's, I mean, there's always something else you can do in vet practise. There's always another phone call you can make, another client you can see, another prescription you can sort. And I think it's a real, really hard for lots of us to just go.

I have to go. I have to walk out of the door and I know that you need help, but you can't have it, so, it is, it is really difficult and I think a lot of clinics are, I think the flexibility is getting better and I think lots of clinics are . Prepared now to negotiate with parents and I think any, any vet vet mum who's been in practise for any length of time before they've had their kids as such an invaluable employee is worth people negotiating.

But for example, the job I'm in now, I do 2 days a week, I'm, I mean it's not massive again because. My child, the childminder I have now is reasonably flexible. So, I leave at 6 o'clock one, well, I'm supposed to leave at 6.

I never leave at 6. I leave at, about 20 2:30 and fly out of the door and rush to get the kids, but she's quite chilled about it, so it's, it's fine. But the other thing I always think about, you know, we all talk about flexibility for work for working parents and practises must offer flexible working, and it's so much better if they do.

And you have to, you know, and, and the onus always seems to me in a lot of the conversations to be on the clinic to be flexible. It's never on the parent, which is understandable because nurseries aren't flexible and so a lot of the time parents' hands are tied, and I understand that, but I do really strongly feel. For me personally, for certainly, but I, I think a conversation has to be had about the responsibility you have as an employee towards the business, to be able to, you know, at the end of the day, we have, they're paying us a wage to do the job and we've got to be able to do that job for them.

And there are, we do, this is a profession where unsociable hours are completely standard, and you know, somebody needs to consult until 7 o'clock at night or whatever it is, or Saturday mornings or early starts and I think. To Be a parent, some parents can't, and that's OK, but I think most of us can to some degree, and I think some degree of flexibility on both sides is really important. So, you know, if you are a parent to be able to say, look, I can only do one late night a week because my mum looks after the kids or my husband gets home from work or something, and to at least offer it, you know, so there's a bit of to, to and fro.

Yeah, absolutely. I think it's just sort of setting, you know, expectations from the start, isn't it, and keeping those conversations going. Yeah, keeping the conversation going is so important because things change all the time.

You know, and you just get your life sorted and you're just like, OK, so Mondays they dance at 6:30, and Tuesdays they just out at 5:30. And then the little blighters get bigger and they move up a class, or they move to a different day. Or you know, or, or suddenly they're, you know, they're going to school or they're not going to school.

So, you know, and then it's the 6 weeks holidays and what on earth do you do then? So you just get a lovely little rhythm going and then something changes. So yes, there's got to be.

There's got to be a regularity, but then there also has to be a flexibility, and I think that's where it's so challenging for, you know, a lot of parents, especially if you don't have a bit of flexibility in your own personal life, like a bit of family support or something to be able to go. Yes, I can absolutely do swimming at 4:30 because I can ask Granny to pick her up or drop her off, or, you know, I can absolutely work that extra day because I can get, you know, my parents-in-laws to do some, do something. Do you know what I mean?

And, it's, it, it, if you don't have any slack in your system, it's very, very challenging, and I really appreciate how lucky I am to have family around me. Yeah, that's brilliant advice. Thank you, Kat.

That's great. . So any other final advice that you would give to any expectant mothers or new mothers on how you can sort of integrate work and family life as a vet, I agree, I hate the term work-life balance because I think you're almost setting yourself up to fail.

I don't think you can ever get the balance right. I think work-life integration, or you know something like that is. Makes a lot more sense.

Would you have any sort of advice for expectant mothers on on work life integration? I think you just have to be. You have to be ready to be flexible, you have to be ready for plans to not work out, you know, and for you to have this grand idea of how it's going to be, and then for it to all be extremely different.

I think you have to just relax a bit and accept less than perfection in all aspects of your life. And I think. You have to, but, you know, enjoy your children and while they're not little for long, I know that's really cliched, but they're not, and they, they change all the time and to be present and to be there is just wonderful.

I, I work two days a week . I tried working 3 recently. It was far too much, so I dropped back down to 2.

My mum, who I adore, worked full time as a GP and I do think that I missed out on a bit of time with her as a kid. So part-time, which just works beautifully. For me, because I do get to spend time with my children.

Even though, you know, after about 10 minutes, I'm like, oh my God, can you just leave me alone? No, you can't have to do. Yes, you can have your iPad.

I don't know where the TV remote is either, do you know what I mean? But. You know, all, all of those things, and I think that just take your foot off the accelerator and, and, and coast for a bit, especially professionally, I think it's OK.

To just be good and you don't have to be brilliant and you don't have to be perfect and there is something really valuable about being just a safe pair of veterinary hands, and you don't have to fly high in the practise and be the expert surgeon and all of that. You can just take your foot off the accelerator a bit and just, you know, I, I, it took me a long time to accept that what I was doing was effectively like relying on. My old skills and knowledge, so when I was first in practise and working full time and, You know, gaining lots of experience, I still use the lessons and the skills that I learned all the way back then, now, and some, and it took me a long time to think, do you know that's OK, I don't have to constantly be, Getting better and better and better even though I want to, you know, and obviously everybody gets better every day, but you know you don't have to be constantly on a, on a massive hamster wheel, you can just think I got this and I can do this, and that's cool and I'm good at what I do, but I don't, you know, I I I've not got any.

I don't know, like, I've not got any extra time in my life to, you know, suddenly start studying for lots of things and for now I'm just gonna coast and I think that's OK, and I think that is something which, which I had to . I had to really learn that, you know, it's just right to just tick along, because you've got a lot a lot of other things on and if you can just reduce the stress in life by letting veterinary coasts, then, you know, that's a good thing. Yeah.

That's wonderful, Kat. Thank you so much. We are just out of time but thank you so much for sharing your experiences and your thoughts with us.

I'm sure a lot of people will relate to a lot of things that you've said. So thank you again and we will speak to you soon. You're very welcome.

Thank you ever so much for having me. Pleasure. Thanks Kat.

Bye, bye.