Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Vet Chat. Today I am very fortunate to be joined by CD Gardiner, who is going to be talking to us about a very important topic, beating veterinary burnout and taking care of your mental health. CD is a life coach who specialises in mindset mentorship and wellness coaching for the veterinary and medical professionals.
She has been qualified as a veterinary surgeon since graduating in 2003, and she's still in first opinion practise today. She currently holds a postgraduate certificate in small animal surgery. She has a life coaching diploma and a nutrition coaching certification.
She's also the proud mom of two boys. In 2018, CD started on her mission to figure out how to really help people make changes. She studied personal growth, psychology, how the brain works to make changes, NLP and many other behaviour science techniques.
Cie has worn many hats throughout her career that have included clinical director, practise and business owner, clinical coach, examiner for Duchy College, guest lecturer for Bicton College and Bristol University too. She spends her spare time collaborating with and working on several working groups and subcommittees on ethnic diversity, equality and inclusion. In July 2021, she started her four year term as our CVS council member and has recently been asked to be a trustee of Vets in Minds, which is a non for profit organisation which aims to be a source of quality information about mental health and wellness for the veterinary market.
So welcome CD, thanks so much for joining me today. Oh, thank you so much for having me, Catherine, it's lovely to be back with you guys. Brilliant.
So the other week, you presented a webinar with the webinar vet, discussing burnout in the veterinary practise, which has been viewed now hundreds of times, which is fantastic, and the feedback has genuinely been incredible. People were so thankful that you shared your experiences and tips and knowledge during the session. So for those who haven't .
Watched the webinar yet, we thought, let's do this podcast, let's keep the discussions going around this topic and, you know, really raise awareness. So should should we start by talking about stress and what stresses to you, CD, and how, how it can affect your body? Oh, what a wonderful way to start.
Yes. You know, there are two parts to the question, you know, first of all, what is stress? So, you know, whether you feel really overwhelmed by everyday challenges or maybe you feel unable to cope with, demands, everybody experiences stress to some degree.
So, a universally accepted, definition posits that stress is experienced when an individual believes that the demand of a given situation pretty much exceeds that personal or social resources that, they're able to mobilise and able to cope. But to be honest with you, stress for me is standard neurobiology. You know, the more fear that enters into the equation of whatever situation you're in.
The more epinephrine and cortisol, which we know are to the main neurochemicals that underpin fear, into the equation. So your brain has a database that it uses to recognise certain things. And this size of, the database, the, the brain's pattern recognition system just shrinks.
So when you face an acute threat, you know, whether it's life-threatening or not, it could be an aggressive client or Even an unwelcome email, the fight or flight response pretty much kicks in. And, we know this as the amygdala hijack. But basically, stress signals to the body to confront a threat or retreat to safety.
OK? And in evolutionary terms, this would have been pretty much helps to improve whether you're able to respond quickly and survive and live another day. So that's how stress kind of responds, really, when, when we kind of feel it.
The second part of your question was, how do, you know, how does it kind of make you feel? And The thing is, Katherine, you know, stress signals to the body, to confront, you know, or retreat. But, the body returns to its normal state and stops producing all of those, chemicals that kind of ready us for battle.
However, when you are exposed to long term stress, it does have negative effects on the body. So stress, that endures and exceeds one's ability to cope may have severe physiological, psychological, as well as behavioural implications. So this could be your brain structure, you know, shrinking, and atrophy of some of your brain cells, which is really scary.
Affecting your memory and your ability. You know, I was talking about that pattern recognition system. Basically, this becomes more of a permanent structure if you're constantly stressed.
You know, increasing your susceptibility to mental ill health, gastrointestinal system, you know, being affected, inflammation, heart condition, all of these things will start, you know, becoming, coming to the fore. Yeah. Brilliant.
No, it's fascinating, isn't it? And I think, you know, stress and mental health and and then now in recent years, you know, more so than ever, it's, it's highly talked about in the workplace and in practise. But what exactly is there now in veterinary medicine and how, how does it differ from stress?
Well, I think, you know, Bernard. Is is recognised as a break between what people are and what they have to do. And it's typically experienced as an emotional exhaustion or depersonalization.
Now, it does burnout actually results from a state of mind that comes from long term, unresolved stress. So stress is the precursor, and then you have burnout. You know, a lot, it affects a lot of medical personnel, veterinary teams, healthcare organisations across the globe, and it has many consequences for the individual.
And you just need to really recognise the symptoms, because they can be similar to other conditions. So I think specifically for all of us who work in the veterinary industry. We have increasingly busy, high pressure work environments, you know, and all the employees, and I'm talking vet nurses, vets, receptionists, animal nursing, assistants, practise managers, admin colleagues, all of us, often become the shock absorbers, you know, taking organisational strain and working longer.
And more like frantic hours. So, you know, you can see it in three ways. We call it the triad of signs, you know, you have the emotional and physical exhaustion.
Number 2, you have depersonalization and cynicism. And then number 3, you've got reduced sense of personal accomplishment. Those are the three main ones that you would see.
Yeah, OK. Brilliant. And I think People who are, you know, starting to feel like they're getting a little bit burnt out or a little bit overwhelmed, I think for some people talking about these things comes very naturally, and it can be a welcome conversation with others, but for others it can be really uncomfortable.
What advice would you give to somebody who's listening who might be hearing you say those things and it resonates with them, what advice would you give them? I think, you know, it's so important for you to know what to do. And, you know, it's, it's one of those things where when I was going through this, I had no idea what I could do, because I thought I was the only one going through it.
And I just want to say, you're not the only one. And there is a continuum of burnout. It isn't the case you're burnt out or you're not.
There are stages to it, you know, so you're not alone. I promise you, let's just try signpost you to places where you can go and find out more information. Yeah.
In the webinar that you gave to the webinar that community a couple of weeks ago, you mentioned that burnout and stress is not the problem. Can you, can you explain that a little bit further for us, please? Yeah, I gave the example at the time that, you know, I've got, I've got two little boys and the big thing about burnout is I feel it is, it's not necessarily a problem because the problem is like.
Maths problem that I help my kids with. There's a specific answer, or a solution to that problem. But because of all of us being so different, all of us having different, backgrounds, burnout is, It's a, it, it's, it's a ever-present and omnipresent risk.
OK, we're all at risk of becoming burnt out, especially if we don't know how to recognise what the symptoms are and the different stages of burnout. And that's what I mean, that it's not a problem. It's something that you cannot fix with one specific solution.
All of us are different. Therefore, all of us will have different ways in which we will need to deal with the different stages of burnout that we're in. Did you know the webinar vet has a public community Facebook group?
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The webinar that community on Facebook. So back to burn out specifically in practise, what are some of the practise management mistakes that can cause burn out within the, the teams of employees would you say? Yeah, this is, this is an interesting one, because depending on the type of practise you're in, and also the individual who's, managing your practise and set up, it, it can vary, you know, but the reality is our HR professionals have an essential role, to play in just reducing the effect and the likelihood of burnout, within any working environment.
And it's so, so important that, We put an effective wellness practises, in place, you know, and they must be at an organisational level. They must work to reduce stress for your team and try to foster employee well-being and engagement. You know, senior leaders and practise managements must educate themselves and practise what they preach.
And what I mean is, there's no point as a practise manager or your senior lead working until 12 midnight and telling everybody, go home at 6, it's fine. People, you know, that is not congruous. So we need to have our practise management team.
Think of well-being more than just a box to tick, or even worse, assume that it's an individual's fault, or that person is experiencing stress is somehow lacking in themselves, or they can't cope. It's more of a holistic approach. Yeah, absolutely.
No, that sounds great. And is, do you have any sort of takeaway tips for people that, you know, listening now? In practise, they might, you know, if they wanted to go in and speak to their teams, you know, say tomorrow about some tips that they could implement relatively quickly to help to prevent employee burnout, what tips would you, would you say?
I think, you know, it's so important as a practise manager or a team leader, even. You don't even need to have that, specific title. But, you know, I think understanding that people need to have, An idea that the psychological safety is protected.
And what I'm talking about is making sure that work is not threatening. OK? Collaborate effectively with your team.
You know, give people clear goals. Don't assume everybody knows what it is they're supposed to do. And I, and I know that sounds small and silly, but it's so important.
Give people clear goals. Make sure they feel heard. If you ask them for their opinion, do something about the stuff that they say, and, you know, make work challenging, that's fine, but not threatening.
Don't make people feel so overwhelmed that they cannot complete the work, and they almost set them up to fail. You know, so that's psychological safety. The second thing you can do is make sure they've got regular workday breaks.
Put them into the diary. Make sure that you don't have them visit after visit after visit where they don't even stop for lunch. That is not reasonable.
OK. People's concentration level reduces significantly after about 2 hours. So make sure you put those breaks in.
You know, set some sort of work boundaries for people and ensure that they've got private space. If you expect them to do writing up notes or any other work that doesn't involve them physically being with animals, make sure they've got time to do it. So as somebody who's in charge of the time, really, as a manager, you can really help increase employee engagement by looking after them with those little tweaks.
Yeah, that's wonderful advice. Thank you. And I guess communication is key as well, isn't it, with all of this?
100%. Yeah. I think if you, if you communicate, and it mustn't be a one-way communication, listen when they communicate back, because sometimes you might have these grand ideas and, and they tell you like, that's not gonna work.
And you're like, Oh, OK. I never thought of that. Why not?
You know, so just listen. It needs to be a two-way thing. Brilliant.
Any other tips or, you know, takeaways that we could do to help to keep our stress levels low? Yeah, there's a couple of things and I think . I, I think I might have put this in the workbook.
And it's really good in that, I think depending on where you're at, you might want to do some no-cost activities, some free activities, all the way to, really expensive things like going on holiday. But there are easy things that you can do today, you know? So, go walking in nature.
And it sounds like a simple. Thing but literally go out, find a park somewhere, go have a walk. You can do some breathing techniques.
You can, master some power naps. These are all free. OK.
Find some humorous, whether it's TikTok videos or some interesting, things that you can chat with your friends. Humour and laughter is a really good tonic. Do some visualisation.
Activating your reticular activating system is such a good way of you visualising, especially if you're in a place where you think, I don't want to be here. I really think I need to leave, which a lot of people start thinking when they're really starting to get burnt out. Start thinking about what it is you want, not things that you don't want, OK?
And please don't hold it in. You know, so if you need to cry, cry. Don't hold it in.
Speak to somebody, OK? And definitely, you know, you can think of doing free things like meditating or yoga, really, really easy things that you can start doing. Brilliant, that's great.
We actually did a podcast a couple of weeks ago with Liz Bar and then she was talking to us all about self-care and the importance of that as well, and she had some great tips like those that might be really useful for people to listen to again as well. Brilliant. Yeah, those those are really helpful.
Brill, so are there any key signs that people should look out for, with whether it's in practise, whether it's with their friends or family, are there any sort of key signs that people who are suffering from burnout tend to show? So, you know, a lot of people ask, Oh, am I suffering from a specific type of burnout? But in reality, there's stages.
And the 5 recognised stages of burnout is, the honeymoon stage where everything is beautiful. You've just started a new job and everything is wonderful. And, there's stage 2, which is the onset of stress.
Stage 3 is chronic stress, stage 4 is burnout, and stage 5 is habitual burnout. So what we wanna do is put some activities in place where we're able to notice which stage we're at and what we can do to bring ourselves back to a nice, even keel. So, you know, things like inability to focus, being irritable, you know, experiencing more headaches, being a lot more anxious, avoiding decision making, procrastinating, you know, having reduced sleep quality, being not as productive.
That is stage 2. It's not even full-on burnout. That's just stage 2.
So if you start recognising these, it's a good way of you knowing which stage you're at. And, you know, when it goes to chronic burnout, you stop doing hobbies, you miss work deadlines, slightly cynical attitude, you know, making really unkind remarks either about the clients or other team members. You know, these are all the sliding scales of things kind of going the wrong direction.
So, it just depends. And I mean, I teach, this is a module I teach in in . In one of the courses I have, and it really is helpful to recognise where you are.
Yeah. Brilliant. That's great, thank you.
So the 5 stages of burnout. And are there any general tips that you have, how people can best if they're recognising these symptoms in people, how to approach them and how to support them with them? You know, I think a lot of people have been told in the past if somebody is .
Suffering from, you know, you may not know, but you think that there is something different about them, that you need to tell somebody else. But in reality, it would have been a world of good if somebody had come up to me and said, Are you OK? You know, just be as kind and simple as asking the person, are you all right?
Is there something I can get for you? You know, and always make sure before you do that, you have an ability to signpost them to a professional who's able to actually take on, you know, the heavy lifting and actually help them if they need to, you know, whether it's a GP or whether it's something like that life or just Be able to signpost them and give them some support in that way. You don't have to do all of that.
You just have to be a person and a human being and care enough to ask them if they're OK. Yeah. Brilliant, that's great Seedy, thank you so much.
Are there any final comments that you'd like to share with our listeners today around this topic? Yeah, I just think, you know, make sure when you're thinking, I'm very stressed, I'm not burnt out yet. When you're even having those comments and conversations in your head, think about the strategies that you've already got in place, you know, which ones are really quick wins?
What, what can I really do? And, You know, have I, have I experienced this problem before? Did I try to solve it?
Did it work? Didn't it? The most important thing, guys, is, where will you be in 5 years' time if you do nothing?
OK, so think about not doing anything, pretending it's all OK. But there's so much help out there, so just like I say, either signpost people who you see who've got this, or if it's, if you recognise some of these things in yourself, think, OK, maybe I need to educate myself and find out more. That's wonderful.
See, thank you so much again for, for joining me today. It's, it's so important that you know people recognise the signs of burnout and we're kind to ourselves and to others, and I think the key point that I took away from our chat is that. You know, burnout is a sign that something needs to change, and I think for anybody listening who needs any more support or advice, please do check out the webinar vets blog, which we'll put on with this podcast, and any resources that you have CD in your workbook, we can absolutely share them with everybody within the community as well.
That's ideal. Thank you so much, Katherine. Thank you, everybody, for listening, because, if you hear this and you think, this could, this could help, I could send this to somebody, please do so and make sure that other people know that it's there for you and anybody else in your team.
It's Wonderful. Oh, thanks so much again. Take care.
Thank you so much for having me.
