Hello, it's Anthony Chadwick from the webinarett welcoming you to another episode of our vet chat. Very fortunate today to have a good friend of mine, Nateian, on the line, who works at Vetstoria. We're gonna talk a little bit about et Storia, particularly with the, the sort of tech angle, you know, how can tech help us work more efficiently as vets.
But . Before we do that, Nate, I thought, obviously I'd like you to introduce yourself, but then I think maybe even before we do that, should we talk a little bit about sustainability, and I know we were talking before, and I, for those of you who are on podcast, you can't see, but I'm just showing Nate one of my. David Attenborough books, which he signed for me when I was 18.
And I know he, you have a little soft spot for David Attenborough, don't you? I do. Yes.
Well, first of all, congratulations on pronouncing my surname Spotan, Zhang. It's the 3rd most, most popular Chinese surname. So, yeah.
Yeah, so fantastic. Thank you for, you know, showing people how it is pronounced properly. Gigi.
That's right. You're welcome. So I know you speak Dutch, so now Chinese as well.
Wonderful. Tiny, tiny. Don't test me anymore.
OK, I won. Yeah, so David Attenborough, I mean, I'm sure you're all watching the Green Planets. I mean, What a mind-blowing series has been.
So I myself, like many people, escaped London during the pandemic, so I'm now in leafy Bexley Heath with a garden and I'm literally watching my tulips pop out just like that. And yeah, it's it's definitely made me a lot more aware of, you know, then how nature is changing and how Fragile, how kind of fragile it is because we're not supposed to have flowers blooming in the season. We have, we barely had a winter, so it's quite worrying.
And yeah, I, I definitely think we, we should all be doing a bit more to, you know, To kind of take care of the planet and having. Come from China, where skyscrapers just get cloned like that. You know, it is very heartbreaking, but at least there is more awareness happening.
So hopefully we'll get to enjoy a much greener planet. I think it's so important, one for planet health, and we talk about one health, it's also our own health, isn't it? We, we just did the virtual congress and we were very fortunate to, to host the Mind Matters initiative symposium as well, which is the Royal College's initiative to help vets to be in, you know, a better place from a a a mental health perspective.
And we had a psychiatrist on who was talking new word for me, you'll probably know it, solastalgia, which is this. This existential dread of of where the planet will go to, and because of that, it's almost a paralysis of, well, it's not worth worrying about and we're not going to do anything about it, and so on. And, you know, being able to sit in that green space, I know the Japanese talk about forest bathing and how that can have such a beneficial effect.
You know, we shouldn't be surprised, should we, that going out and having a green space that you can be in is, is fantastic for mental health and the pandemic has obviously caused issues, but I think it's also, That hopefully in 5 years we see it as a time of sacrifice, but also where maybe we had a reset and there's maybe blessings involved with that as well. Well, I mean, I, I'm no expert on this, but I would say I'm dying to go to your congress conference. No, well, well, that's another one that we'll we'll talk about, to the community later, but I think it's gonna be .
Great for us as a profession, how can we lead other professions, you know, we love animals, we obviously understand and love the environment, this whole one health area, if we get the environment right. If we're looking after animals and their welfare is improving, then. We as humans should be happier as well, and life is about creating happiness and joy, isn't it?
I don't think this has got anything, anything to do with tech though, has it? I feel like I'm, you know, as a marketing manager for a tech company with the venting space. I have read a few philosophy books, but I feel like I, I don't know, I'm not that confident to, come in and, and contribute to the big discussion.
I would say though, so I, this, so, you know, if any, if anybody wants to know what Boria does, we, we do, we automate the appointment booking process, so that practises don't need to answer the phone as much. And, we see a lot of People that go to the practise, and, you know, they're faced with busy receptionists answering the phone without getting that personalised service. And what I've noticed in recent months is that a lot of pet owners, they do need, they do crave connection, especially during COVID.
So, you know, having moved to Bexley Heath, I've, you know, most of, most of my neighbours are, I guess, above a certain age, and they all have a pet. So sometimes I feel like they really want to talk to me. It's, maybe I'm just being a narcissist.
But I feel like they do want to kind of, you know, there's this Chinese guy that just moved into the neighbourhood. What's his story. So I always ask, you know, oh, can I ask you a question about gardening?
And I'd say, oh, do you grow lilies? And they said, oh, I love lilies, but they're poisonous to my dogs and they're poisonous to my cat. And I thought, wow, that's interesting.
And I immediately asked, what breed of the dog do you have? And their faces just like they'd even mimic, you know, the behaviours of their pets and how eccentric they might they might be. And sometimes the conversation would turn, you know, at a little sombre where they kind of take back a little and say, 0, 10 years ago, I lost my husband, and, and my children have moved away, but they're doing amazing things in that city over there.
So it's so behind every pet, behind every garden, there is a story of, you know, a bond or a story of loss. So those are precisely the kind of conversations I think should be happening. You know, with the practise person.
In a practise, yeah. You know, when, when they bring their dog in, they want to tell you about what their dogs have done, how funny they have been. But if you're kind of tied up to the phone the entire time, it's just not possible to offer that service.
Practise is, is so busy and I think one of the famous internet marketer, a guy called Brendan Bouchard was saying, you know, how do you make use of tools. So that your practise can run more efficiently, but actually also, so how can it help you to save time? You know, if, if, as you say, you're on the phone and you've got to take an appointment, and you're on the phone for 2-3 minutes taking that appointment, that's 2 or 3 minutes that you can't do something else with.
But actually, it's also the client who's been left waiting 5 minutes before they actually got on for the 2 to 3 minutes. Yeah. And, and actually, you know, they go to their hairdressers and they can book remotely, and they go to other places where they can book remotely and yes.
They come to a veterinary practise and we can be a conservative profession. They want to, they want to see things that will help their lives, but it will also help the veterinary practise personnel as well, won't it? Yeah.
And, Anthony, thank you for dropping a business person's name. So I won't feel like a snob by dropping in, you know, business terms. So Brandon Bouchard, OK, look him up.
Anthony recommends it. So, you know, about you, the point you made, people can easily make an appointment with the hairdressers. I think there's a study by, I think either Imperial College or one of the business schools in London.
About since the COVID pandemic, 75, the 45% of the over 75 are new internet users. Yeah. That's incredible.
So basically, what practises have been saying, oh, you know, my clients aren't tech savvy. Well, guess what they are. They, they've booked their COVID vaccines, you know, on their phone.
They've ordered after the delivery. You know, during isolation. So you can't say that anymore.
It's not just the millennials that need digital stuff. You have to really cater to all demographics. But there's another business theory, I can't remember the person, but, some people call it the diffusion of innovation.
Some people call it the innovation adoption curve. It, it sounds fancy, but really, it just means some people adopt early, some people adopt late. And I can clearly see this from the 3 years of working at Vitoria.
So. This obviously handles the appointment booking process and some practises were there from the very beginning. Some practises opened already with online booking in place and I would generally, generally group, you know, the corporate and the independence because I think The huge difference between corporate independence, like not the clinical stuff, but just from a marketing perspective working in vestoria.
I just know that there's a lot of emphasis focused on marketing for corporate clinics. You know, vets are probably not marketeers, but when it comes to communicating a message as clearly as possible to your clients, when it comes to acquiring new clients, marketing is essential. And of course, corporate clinics, they understood this and that's why they were the earliest adopters of Astoria.
And then, you know, the, we see the pattern is pretty much the same everywhere. We were, we broke Australia first, I would say, because of the practise management system, over there, we integrated with first. So corporates jumped on board first and then we saw independence.
But still, I wouldn't be surprised if practises say, you know what, the way we've been working is fine. Obviously, it's not fine because we know that there is huge mental health strain on the staff and, you know, the phone is always busy and, and pet owners expect online booking. But they're still saying, you know, we, we're fine the way we are.
That's one type of independent clinics and there's another type, which is I think we should name them because they are the ones that really embrace technology and we have quite a few that opened during the pandemic. You know, you would think it's the worst time to open a new business, but completely contrary to that. So I know that Doctor David Hodges opened his brilliant startup set of vets already with the story in place.
And they automated appointment booking and payments and it took, you know, for the first couple of weeks or months, they didn't even have a receptionist. You know, just to imagine how efficient that, that was. And we have a couple of cool, very exciting visionary influencers that have been working at a corporate clinic or, or, you know, the clinic they've been working at for a long time, and they decided to open their own practise after the pandemic already with everything automated.
And just to, you know, I think it's, so you do have the leg guards and the vanguards even within the independent space. So I think. You know, we we we can always.
There's like if you do feel like. The way you've been working is no longer working and help is there. There are some really cool tools, you know, if we go back 12 years, I, I was a, a vet in practise, doing a bit of dermatology and went off to an internet conference and heard about webinars.
And I thought this is something we should be bringing into the profession. There was really no online space, you know, nobody knew I went to the BSABA conference happening in another month or two in Manchester. And we, I went around the congress and I talked to the various companies and said you should be doing webinars and they said.
What's a webinar? So it's now the most common way that people learn, and I think what we're seeing is, you know, people coming in in a disruptive way, which is a good way, you know, because it moves the industry forward. We're seeing more and more of this tech disruption, which, which I think the majority of it can only help the profession, there's possibly some bits you may want to argue about, but I think the majority tech will, will help to make us more efficient and, you know, the, the stuff you're talking about there is very much the other example is the iPhone, when the iPhone came out, there were the, you know, the evangelists who were out there, it's a piece of Apple, we need to get it.
And then slowly other people start buying it, and now pretty much everybody in the UK has a smartphone, don't they? Yeah, I mean, I think online booking for me is the norm. It's no, no doubt about that and practise is that I think the sooner they realise, you know, there is a huge chunk of time that could be saved.
You know, forget about client acquisitions. Forget about, you know, Facebook, Google ads, integration, forget about all these fancy marketing stuff, but just the actual benefit of having some more time on your hands for more breaks, for more patient care is already good value. And, and, you know, there will come a day when all the pet owners will say, I'm not going to call you.
And that's when you'll have to start, you know, implementing, you know, online booking. No, I think you're right. I, I would still say at the moment it's, and I know some companies don't do it, you know, if you try and get on to contact some companies trying to get them on the phone is, is nearly impossible.
I, I still think that we should have the option for some people who, you know, because if you're in an emergency, my dog's bleeding, I need to come down. I don't want to mess around with the computer for 10 minutes, of course that should still be possible. But the reality is that if half of your appointments are booked remotely, that is saving you a massive amount of time, isn't it?
100%. And imagine if you're trying to get through to the practise and it's engaged. It's engaged because somebody's trying to book an appointment.
Yeah, so online booking is obviously not removing the phone line, it's actually making it more. Important for these important conversations to take place. Exactly.
No, it's a really good point. I mean, and I think you brought a really good point, just before. I've been talking for the last 5 years, and I, I'm not gonna say it's my original idea.
I went to a, a Vett Futures event and Nick Stace, who at the time was the CEO of the Royal College, said something that stuck with me, said, every business. Is a digital business, or should be. And you know, I took that and obviously we were, you know, we were an online business, we were digital.
But I, I very much made it my mantra to speak to practicers and say, you know, you should be digital, you know, at that time, Facebook page, you know, obviously being able to book remotely. All of those things will make you more attractive. And in fact, I'll go as far as to say that if you're not a digital business within the next 10 years, you will disappear.
Yeah, well, I completely agree with that. What happened was COVID came along and those businesses that weren't digital, a percentage of them have already disappeared, so it's accelerated the process. So if you don't make that effort of becoming digital, you probably won't exist for very much longer.
Well, I think the key thing here is that when when we talk about digital, it's. Everything else is already digital. I mean, if, if we're arguing, you know, for not making the necessary changes because you're a veterinary.
Which is in itself a little bit. Patronising, I would say, but not that different from any other business in a sense. But yeah, so, you know, I loved something I read which is that the COVID pandemic has made turned everyone into a millennial.
And you know, before the pandemic, we were talking about, you know, there's a client Perkins study talking about how millennials like to communicate and that's online. But now, you know, everybody is a millennial. But another point, I was going to make is, I think that the point about adopting technology of being digital.
So there is an element about recruiting that we also need to think about. You know, the more digital you are, the more it projects onto the candidate that you are a modern forward thinking practise and that you might, you would probably have a better workflow. And if you, and when the candidate is searching for their next, you know, job, they go on your website and if your website looks like a Windows 95 type of website.
Compared to another one, that might be a bit further away, but they have online booking and they, they have good reviews and they have good online presence and they have an Instagram profile. It just shows that maybe you could be joining a better workplace culture. We had this same experience, I set up my practise in 1997 and very quickly got involved with, you know, building a nice website for the practise.
Using things like Google AdWords to promote the practise. I remember one person coming in and it happened a number of times where she said, yeah, we looked at all the practises in Liverpool, but yours was the only one we could see the inside of through the website, and it looked a great website and so we thought if you can make a great website, you're probably a great practise. And so we definitely won clients, and I remember Yellow Pages, if you remember Yellow Pages came in.
I don't actually. Yellow Pages was this huge big directory thing. And we used to always obviously put an adverts in and then obviously was doing that less and less.
And they said, oh well, we can now get you to the top of Google AdWords, you know, top of Google, it'll cost you £3000 a year, and I said, well. It's only costing me 10 pence per click, so I think I'll just stay in. I was actually above Yellow Pages on vets in Liverpool.
So it's it's so important to. Be seen as a digital business, as you say, not only for clients but also for team who will be more attracted to you and also if, if people aren't spending time on the phone, they can spend time as you said earlier, speaking to clients more. You know, be they vets, nurses, or receptionists.
You know, I spoke to, so a good friend of mine, Le Pascal, who's a district manager, for Vests now. So she told me she's had many 14 hour shifts without a loo break. Mm, I mean.
I think there's obviously the stoic quality is, commendable. But it, but it but it's not good for long term health. I mean, I'm, I, I'm not from a veterinary background.
To me, that is bonkers. You really shouldn't be working that long without a break. You shouldn't be working in that condition.
And I think that kind of comes back to why I think the veterinary industry, some practises are slow to look at different solutions. I think there's this culture of just keep, you know, just keep going, just to keep going and, and we at Astoria, I think at least the London and the US office, more than half of our staff. Have the same story, which is that they used to be a vet or a nurse or a practise manager.
And that kind of mental health aspect has driven them away from their beloved profession. And now they're kind of working in the peripheral of the practise, but still in the industry because they just can't let go of animal healthcare. And many of them would jump on the opportunity to work as a, you know, clinician again, but the situation is not getting better, you know, with the 2 million new pets in the UK since 2020.
We're seeing more and more vets and nurses and and people that leave their profession. And, you know, and, and that's why I think it's. Time saving strategies are so important, whether they are better time management, you know, of yourselves, of the workflow, or using tools, you know, like that story, I think there's, there's no doubt that we can work more efficiently, can't we?
Definitely, and, and I think we've had, I've done a survey about, you know, for, yeah, you would, just to see how can we best show you that help is here. Yeah. Without, you know, you feeling like you're too busy to look at it.
And the funniest answer I thought was that if you give us lunch, we'll do, we'll do a lunch demo with you. And, and, and this just goes to show how there is no time at the practise. So imagine if a phone call takes 2 to 3 minutes to to do for a routine appointment booking.
And multiply that by the number of appointments you actually get. And that's why, you know, we've done loads of case studies and, there's one with IBC Evidencia that literally said we save up hours per week, hours. And I, you know, it's a significant, I think that, you know, again, as I said, going back to Brendan, you know, use tools in your business if you want to, whether you're a butcher baker or candlestick maker.
The more digital tools that you can use that will save you time. You know, the better, so it's it's really great what you're doing, you know, thank you for, for all that you're doing for the profession with that story, enjoyed the conversation, we didn't even talk about the fine arts, which I'm a little bit disappointed about. But this was New York and.
But it's, but it's good because I have to represent Voria and I have to remind myself that we have company values. It's great that we stay professional. Yeah.
Well, you are very welcome to come and, and hopefully we will see you at the the green congress later on in June, so I will be, I will be letting you know some details about that. Cool, I'll bring out my green mantis outfit. Nate, it's been so good to speak to you.
I think it's really fascinating some of those, thoughts, you know, on the pandemic. I think it, they, as I said at the beginning, I hope that although it's been a time of great sacrifice and, and sadness, that perhaps in 2 or 3 years' time, we'll look at it and say, actually, it was a wake up call for all sorts of areas, the environment, mental health. Just being able to sit outside and enjoy listening to the birds singing.
Some of those things are just so important, aren't they, and it's been great for you to bring that up. I, I, I'm gonna leave you so you can go outside and, and sit and enjoy your tulips. Yeah, well, and just cry for Mother Nature.
But, thank you so much for having me and, and, and Vitoria. And for any webinar that, subscribers, I think we have, one really cool topic with Allison Lambert and Kate McMurray. On your platform about automation and its relationship with, Frontex stuff.
So I recommend you check that out as well. We can, we can perhaps we'll put a link underneath the podcast so people can go direct and have a nose at that as well. That's a good point, Nate, a good closing point.
I will, we'll leave you with that. Yeah. Thanks so much, Nate.
Take care. Bye bye, everyone.
